Is a dying character still bloodied?

[Turtlejay]

*Everything* in the rules has a duration. (save ends) is a duration. So you keep suffering the effect until a save ends it.

Bloodied is a condition like the rest (dying is a condition, too!). You are bloodied until the definition of bloodied is no longer met. Are you at less than half hit points? Bloodied! Is -10 less than 22? Bloodied!

I have noticed a few opinions here saying that it does not 'seem' or 'feel' right. That is cool for you, but it has like, zero effect. For all conditions, whether it feels right or not, you must do this.

Jay

 

[ValhallaGH]

For all conditions, whether it feels right or not, you must do this.

Until the DM house rules it. Then you do what the DM says.

But Jay's logic is correct.

 

[N0Man]

It seems clear to me that a dying character is still bloodied, however this is one of those things that some people just don't agree in. You won't reach a consensus on this one. I've seen it argued for many pages in past threads.

 

[kilpatds]

Heal Each Turn: If you have regeneration and at least 1 hit point, you regain a specified number of hit points at the start of your turn. If your current hit point total is 0 or lower, you do not regain hit points through regeneration.

So while someone who is unconscious from being below 0 hp is still bloodied, they also do not regenerate.

 

[Destil]

So while someone who is unconscious from being below 0 hp is still bloodied, they also do not regenerate.

Awesome, I never noticed that! I think I know how I'll fix the most problematic healing powers now if it comes down to it (Sacred Ground I'm looking at you. And you look like regeneration when bloodied...)

 

[RigaMortus2]

It seems clear to me that a dying character is still bloodied, however this is one of those things that some people just don't agree in. You won't reach a consensus on this one. I've seen it argued for many pages in past threads.

Doesn't matter if there is a consensus, the rules are the rules.

I also don't get the "doesn't feel right" arguement either.

Rules wise:
Bloodied = less than half hit points. If you are unconcious and dying and below 0 hit points, are you at less than half hit points?

Look at it from a reality based perspective too...
If someone was Bloodied in a fight, you might say that they were attacked/hit to the point where they are bleeding. If you are bloodied in a fight, then fall unconcious, do your wounds suddenly close up because you are now unconcious/dying?

 

[Vendark]

The example of Anvil the dwarf fighter on page 295 of the PHB certainly reads as if bloodied and dying are meant to be discrete states, and when you enter one you exit the other. It's not explicit, unfortunately.

At least one power also supports the idea that they are mutually exclusive. From Divine Power, page 41:

"Revive
Target: One bloodied or dying ally or a dead ally who died during this encounter."


There'd be no reason for the distinction between a bloodied and a dying ally if you were also bloodied while dying.

 

[keterys]

Sadly, one reason is so that people wouldn't get confused "Does this work on a dying guy? I know it says bloodied, and maybe creatures at 0 or lower still are bloodied, but Dying feels like a discrete different thing..."

So it doesn't really prove anything, on its own.

Frankly, nerf Consecrated Ground on its own merits - such as by making it regeneration instead of a heal (which has a number of other benefits). I think half the reason people are so adamant about 0 or lower != bloodied is that one power.

 

[RigaMortus2]

The example of Anvil the dwarf fighter on page 295 of the PHB certainly reads as if bloodied and dying are meant to be discrete states, and when you enter one you exit the other. It's not explicit, unfortunately.

At least one power also supports the idea that they are mutually exclusive. From Divine Power, page 41:

"Revive
Target: One bloodied or dying ally or a dead ally who died during this encounter."


There'd be no reason for the distinction between a bloodied and a dying ally if you were also bloodied while dying.

They are different conditions, but one does not nullify the other. It would be like if there was a power that read "One dazed or one stunned enemy" or "One unconcious or prone ally". Two seperate conditions, they have similiar effects (stunned is "dazed+" as dying is "bloodied+"), you can be both at the same time.

 

[Aulirophile]

But how are you going to sue your second wind when dying? I only see a couple ways to do so, like th heal skill and a paragon path feature. It is not whenever you spend a healing surge.

Use Second Wind: Make a DC 10 Heal check to allow an adjacent character to use his or her second wind without the character having to take an action to do so. The character doesn’t gain the defense bonuses normally granted by second wind. Found under the Heal Skill, First Aid: Standard Action.