D&D 4E Is anyone running Murder in Baldur's Gate with 4E? (and other 4E adventure design issues)

[MerricB]

A recent post on the Wizards boards indicated that the DM would no longer be running Murder in Baldur's Gate because it has "nothing resembling a traditional 4E encounter". (source). I'm curious: is anyone running MiBG with 4E here? How is it going?

I'm running it as Next. The other DM at my FLGS runs it as 4E. I don't think he's having that much trouble.

I believe that my strengths as a DM come from story-telling and rules knowledge, although I'm not particularly strong in tactical encounter design. For me, the combats are there to help tell the story and let the players feel good about themselves - a few combats will try to be very challenging, but it isn't my default mode. In my 4E campaign, I'm happily improvising combats all the time, so the "build your own" ethos of MiBG fits right into that. Having an adventure that lets the players have a lot of freedom is fantastic for me.

However, what I'm taking away from that disappointed DM's comment is that 4E adventures should be linear and force the players into set-piece combat: there isn't room to improvise.

So, is anyone running MiBG using 4E? Are you finding it difficult because of the lack of set-piece encounters? And is 4E really so limited in adventure design space?

Cheers!

 

[Morrus]

What does he mean by a traditional 4E encounter? The two-page encounter spread?

I haven't played 4E in a long time. Some published adventures had very identikit encounters, but I definitely recall some variety. Hell, deviating from the norm is what attracts me to an adventure.

 

[MerricB]

What does he mean by a traditional 4E encounter? The two-page encounter spread

I presume so. MiBG has a basic structure, but the actual encounters are up to the individual DM in how (and whether) they happen. There are suggested monsters, but everything else is up to the DM. It's just the context that the adventure gives. I glory in it, actually. But reducing this to only set piece encounters? Urgh.

Cheers!

 

[Morrus]

I guess it's a target audience thing. I personally don't get on with the two-page encounter spread thing, but I'm sure it makes things easier for some people.

 

[keterys]

I can see being disappointed, especially for Encounters, in it from a 4e standpoint. There's a _lot_ of combats which have nothing that would make them tactically interesting without a fair bit of improvisation, and possibly even with that.

Ie, fighting several of the same exact (not very interesting) guys on a road.

There's also a fair chance that you have all your dailies, and it's a total pushover, as a result. MiBG requires a lot of DM work to make it shine. For good or ill.

 

[D'karr]

So, is anyone running MiBG using 4E? Are you finding it difficult because of the lack of set-piece encounters? And is 4E really so limited in adventure design space?

Cheers!

I am. I'm like you in that I can free-wheel the adventures pretty much at-will. Based on the MiBG format. I can see how a DM that has gotten used to the D&D Encounters format would find the adventure "frustrating" to run. It provides no maps at all except for the map of BG. The encounters are mostly boring. It simply has some "teaser notes" in case of an encounter, and that is only if the DM decides to even run an encounter. The Monster stats are on a separate downloadable document, and are mostly uninteresting, etc.

So yes, this is as far removed from the D&D Encounters format that DMs have been running for 14 seasons. I can see how someone that has only seen that format might run into some issues.

Is the format unworkable, not by a long shot.

My players have had a fight in The Wide against the Bhaalspawn slayer and some thugs. They setup an ambush against Thangol the toll collector. They chased Laraelra out of her tavern and had a protracted chase (completely improvised skill challenge) trying to catch her. Of course the booklet doesn't give any guidance (or so little that it might as well be none.) for how to set these things up. I just made them up based on what the players wanted. So the adventure has been mostly run as improv.

This past week we had no combat, the party spent the majority of time questioning the dwarf at the Dancing Axe, the alchemist (forget their names), and getting their hair done by her. Then they went to Wyrm's Rock to get an update on Laraelra's interrogation. They chased Lord Dlusker around to find out what was going on with him, and they finally made it to Eastway to see the Flaming Fist "abusing their power." Next week we start with a fight.

I'm running for a very large group (9 players) and I've had to pace things by being very frenetic and not letting players lollygag on their decisions, but it's working well. Next week's combat will be interesting.

 

[MerricB]

Nine players! Ye gods! I know I run that in AD&D quite often, but it's still quite a challenge in 4E. I salute you!

 

[D'karr]

Nine players! Ye gods! I know I run that in AD&D quite often, but it's still quite a challenge in 4E. I salute you!

Thanks for the salute, but I don't find it a big deal as I'm used to it. My regular group is 7-9 players when they all show up.

In season 1 of Encounters I had a table of 12 at one time, that was fun but exhausting.

What I like least about MiBG is that the adventure itself is uninteresting, to me. I guess it is the premise of "best of all evils". That type of story just doesn't do it for me unless the player characters really have a good hook to it. At this time none of them have any attachment to any of the NPCs. So they are pretty much chasing around town with little motivation. They did seem to click with the alchemist so I'm thinking that I'm going to put a really good twist and use her a lot more.

 

[MerricB]

That type of story just doesn't do it for me unless the player characters really have a good hook to it. At this time none of them have any attachment to any of the NPCs.

That's pretty true. Thankfully, both of our groups very much decided to go for the "rise up against the oppressors" storyline in a big way. They're actually causing even more unrest in the city!

Cheers!

 

[Will Doyle]

What does he mean by a traditional 4E encounter? The two-page encounter spread?

I'm guessing he means a mix of monster roles (skirmishers, brutes, etc) with a variety of terrain that makes for interesting tactical choices on the battlemap. How the encounter is formatted in the adventure booklet isn't so important as how its components interact on the table (also, the delve format has been abandoned for a while now). It's more than possible to improvise, but the best encounter synergies require a bit of thought.