Is D&D good?

[ajanders]

I know I'm asking for it to say this HERE, but here goes:
Playing D&D is bad.
Don't misunderstand me. I love the game. But spending time playing it, when all of humanity has SO MANY more important things to do, like helping the hungry and poor and sick, researching cures and advancing science, and so on, is bad......

(Deletia)

But make no mistake about it. D&D is bad. But so what? You're soaking in bad all over, and most of it is a LOT worse.....

It's true. While playing D&D you're not saving whales, serving in a soup kitchen, or curing cancer.
Of course, you aren't doing that while you sleep and visit the toilet, either.
Yielding to opportunity cost is no reason for moral censure.

 

[Haradim]

It's just this: For most of us, in the game, if our characters heard that there was a horrible plague, or a famine, or an oppressive government in a neighboring land (that wasn't an enemy), we would be off and charging to the rescue.

It should be noted that this is often simply because that's the plot of the day/month/campaign; not doing that may well mean there is no game. I know some people who need to be prodded along a bit to do such deeds, even if they are Good, and the fact that it's 'The Quest' is often the only thing that gets them going.

On a more 'ingame' level, many characters only do that for power, fame, and the almighty gold piece (regardless of what their alignment is); 'fighting the good fight' is a means to an end, and adventuring is an extremely effective way to better one's life compared to conventional means. Take away the rewards, and the number of willing heroes would probably make quite the nosedive.

True selflessness and altruism is probably not as common as one might think in a 'heroic adventure' game, as they tend to work against the player at the metagame level. Aside from (highly optional) Exalted abilities, being really Good in this fashion doesn't necessarily make life much better for the PC, and can indeed work in the opposite fashion (heard of many generous ascetics(sp?) prior to the Vow of Poverty? I know I didn't...)

It's cliche, but true - all evil needs to win is for good people to stand by and do nothing.

This statement strikes me as working far better in DnD than it does in reality.

 

[Tuzenbach]

Would you believe I did a junior college speech on the very topic of D&D being good? Afterwords, the teacher wanted me to join the speech team!

Consider the alternatives: watching TV (leading to loss of brain cells), full-time web surfing (ditto, but less so-at least the internet is interative!), constantly going to movies (bad for the eyes, stifles the imagination), sex (could get you killed these days), drinking/drugs (see sex), Vegas (could make you broke real fast).

D&D is good for group dynamics, enhancing leadership qualities/abilities, creative/analytical thinking, dramatic appreciation/improvisation skills, and is actually quite useful as a disguised vehicle for group/play therapy. All of these things plus the stimulation of brain cells that just won't happen if you're sitting on your ass watching TV and eating chips.

 

[Zappo]

All the typical attacks on D&D can be debunked pretty easily with the material linked in this thread. I've found that most attacks on roleplaying games base themselves on blatant distortion of facts (if not outright lies) and making sure that noone who could do the defense is anywhere near.

 

[francisca]

I know I'm asking for it to say this HERE, but here goes:

Playing D&D is bad.

Don't misunderstand me. I love the game. But spending time playing it, when all of humanity has SO MANY more important things to do, like helping the hungry and poor and sick, researching cures and advancing science, and so on, is bad.

I know what you may be thinking - doesn't this apply to almost everything we do? The answer is yes. And after a few idealistic years, usually in our teens or college years, most of us get tired of trying to find a place to get a good grip on the gargantuan tasks that we face as a species, especially with others who have given up fighting us, and give up to go focus on just our own little piece. From within that perspective, D&D is pretty darned good. As compared to actively making trouble for other people, or indulging in actively self-destructive behavior.

But make no mistake about it. D&D is bad. But so what? You're soaking in bad all over, and most of it is a LOT worse.....

Yeah, like that time when my buddy got a call during our game to tell him his grandfather died. He was glad we were there to help him cope. Man that was bad.

I guess getting together on a regular basis, to keep old friendships strong and forge new ones, is really self-destructive.

Give me, and more importantly -- yourself, a break.

 

[francisca]

Lets get one thing straight here. Jack Chick and Pat Pulling are nut cases that have nothing to do with the so-called "religious right". If there is such a thing.

Growing up in a religious family that could be termed "right-wing", I have never met anyone who felt the way they did.

Sorry to offend you. And you are correct. bad choice of words on my part.

 

[Torm]

Rel - I can definitely tell you who the "scumsuckers" are, and without getting political, either. (Not to say that some people in politics aren't part of who I'm talking about, but not all of them, and certainly not all of any particular party.) They're the people who, as I said before, have the power and resources to make the sort of changes you (I'm assuming) or I would like to make to help people, but use it all only to further some narrow self-serving agenda and/or make themselves richer. Five million dollars (U.S.) is (more than?) enough to live VERY nicely for a moderate sized family without ever having to work again or really want for much of anything that any sane person would want, but we have people out there with BILLIONS, and they use them like they're nothing but tools in a game to get more. At the height of his fortune, a certain BILLionaire had enough finances that he could've paid for full college educations, including food and housing, for every child in K-12 at the time - off just INTEREST on his money. Without losing anything he had at the start of the process. Or he could have performed any number of noble acts that are beyond what most people dream of doing. I'm not asking for a handout from anybody, but I think about what I would do, and can't help but wonder why we never see ANY of it. I mean, heck, its not even totally unselfish - haven't these people ever heard of having a legacy?

And not all of the people I'm talking about are extremely rich or internationally known - I guarantee there are people you know of in your own community who act like life is a game they're playing AGAINST everyone else, and they're going to win.

francisca - I didn't say D&D was an absolute bad, or "evil". I was just presenting one thing I had thought of as bad about the game before, since no one was saying anything negative at that point. You have to admit, D&D is a hobby that takes up a lot more time than most others, especially for some powergamers who make a lifestyle out of it, and that has a great deal of potential to take away from other, dare I say, more worthy activities.

But at least D&D players aren't smoking crack. At least, most of them.

I'm glad your group was there for your friend, and I wouldn't take a thing away from that.

all - I'm sorry it's been coming out in some of my posts, but I'm having a REALLY bad week (about the 4th worst ever, and if you knew my history, that's saying a LOT) and I guess its got me thinking more than usual about how things are just screwed up all over. I feel like I should be doing more with my life, and looking around, I see a lot of other people that it seems like are letting themselves and the rest of us down, too. And it makes me feel guilty about not doing anything about it, but I'm tired. If you're happy and enjoy D&D, I don't mean to take anything away from that - probably the best GOOD thing in the world is managing to be happy in all this crap.

 

[Nilhgualcm Leahcim]

I'm not sure how you demonstrate that any hobby is a good thing. Building models? Painting landscapes? Collecting stamps? Writing poetry? Playing bridge? All are widely accepted hobbies; how do you argue that they're good?

Maybe it is better not to argue that the hobby is good, but that the hobby is not an evil, noxious game filled with devil-worshipping adolescents who play only to learn occult secrets! I think that this is the point to make in the report.

 

[Rel]

Torm, I'm really sorry that you're having such a bad week. I truly hope it gets better. I know that whenever I'm in a crappy mood, it always makes me feel better to do something nice for someone else. Maybe try that.

It happens that you and I have very different ideas of who the "scumsuckers" of the world are. I'm not a rich man by any means. In fact, I probably make a little less than the average person my age (I don't know because what I do have in common with you is that I'm not keeping score with money). Nonetheless, I can't bring myself to despise any of the billionaires out there, who give millions and millions of dollars to charity every year, just because they don't give even more. Those sorts of people pay so much in taxes alone that it keeps my country humming along quite nicely.

Anyway, try not to let it get you down. Life's too short to be resentful of the way other people dispose of their own money. Instead, focus on the good that you can do, but save a little time, money and joy for yourself too.

That's about all I got on this one. Hope things take a turn for the better.

 

[Nilhgualcm Leahcim]

I was in a gamestore about four or five months ago and saw a family shopping around. "What's upstairs?" they asked. "The roleplaying game material," replied the shop owner. "Roleplaying games? Like D&D? Oh lord, we can't go there! Those games are like Satan worship and all. Nothing good there. No morality." Then a pause. "Oh look, NASCAR Monopoly!"

Something similar happened to me recently, however it was the game-store owner who freaked out and called it a devil-worshipping game. He called it this as the Todd MacFarlane Spawn action figures grinned down malevolently at me from behind him. Hmmmm...