Is Improved Natural Attack a 'no brainer' for Monks?

[Infiniti2000]

Correction: Per the monk size damage table, 2d8 (9) --> 3d8 (13.5) gains 4.5

Why don't you use the feat?

 

[Artoomis]

I voted "No" because there is no "Maybe" or "Sometimes" or "It Depends" option.

Monks are generally best at survival, not damage-dealing. I would definately take this feat for a small (halfling) monk to offset thr size penalty, but, generally, a monk is rather best when not attempting to optimize damage output.

 

[Rashak Mani]

The higher the campaign is... the more useful the feat...

Higher levels have more DR, your stats are more important than feats, damage levels up.

 

[Borlon]

I voted "No" because there is no "Maybe" or "Sometimes" or "It Depends" option.

Monks are generally best at survival, not damage-dealing. I would definately take this feat for a small (halfling) monk to offset thr size penalty, but, generally, a monk is rather best when not attempting to optimize damage output.

No one in our circle of gamers seems to have the knack of playing a monk. Maybe it is just the campaign style.

If you were playing a medium sized, survival oriented monk, what feats would you be taking at 6th and 9th levels instead of INA?

 

[Dr_Rictus]

Yeah, where the heck is the "I may or may not take this feat" option?

The only monk in my current game is a halfling, and has only entered melee so far in one fight over the course of three levels. Call him crazy, but everyone's having fun so far.

 

[Artoomis]

No one in our circle of gamers seems to have the knack of playing a monk. Maybe it is just the campaign style.

If you were playing a medium sized, survival oriented monk, what feats would you be taking at 6th and 9th levels instead of INA?

Well, I'd certaiinly consider saving throw boosting, if not already taken. Dodge-mobility-Srping Attack is also good - and then dart in, "disarm" a spell component pouch, and dart out again. There is not even an opposed attack roll for this!

There are LOTS of feat choices other thna those that directly improve melee damage. A monk is all about survivability and mobility. Maximize those two features and he gets really, really dangerous in a fight.

If your DM allows it, take Improved Spell Resistence - normally an epic feat, but maybe your DM will permit it. If so, take it twice.

This is the sort of thing monks are REALLY good at. Direct, toe-to-toe melee is generally a bad idea.

 

[KarinsDad]

It's absolutely a no-brainer. Anything that gives you better damage than weapon specialization is a no-brainer. Let's look at the average numbers, starting from the minimum value at 6th level, and considering only medium-sized monks.

1d8 (4.5) --> 2d6 (7) = gains 2.5 damage, already better than WS
1d10 (5.5) --> 2d8 (9) = gains 3.5, significantly better than WS
2d6 (7) --> 3d6 (10.5) = gains 3.5, same gain as previous increase
2d8 (9) --> 4d6 (14) = gains 5, holy smokes this is huge for a feat
or 2d8 (9) --> 3d8 (13.5) = gains 4.5, holy smokes this is huge for a feat
2d10 (11) --> 4d8 (18) = gains 7, that's huge

This is true according to the rules. It is also true due to a flaw in the rules. The size weapon category table and monk size damage tables have a serious flaw in them. Instead of going from 1D8 to 1D10 for large creatures, they skip a "die" and go to 2D6. Without that "error", it would not be as significant and it would balance out somewhat with Weapon Specialization.

1d8 (4.5) --> 1d10 (5.5) = gains 1
1d10 (5.5) --> 2d6 (7) = gains 1.5
2d6 (7) --> 2d8 (9) = gains 2
2d8 (9) --> 3d6 (10.5) = gains 1.5
2d10 (11) --> 3d8 (13.5) = gains 2.5

Now, you can debate whether this is a flaw or not, but it seems slightly unbalanced, especially when you are discussing feats.

A medium D6 weapon becomes a large D8 weapon (29% increase).

A medium D8 weapon becomes a large 2D6 weapon (56% increase). Considering that larger creatures also tend to get Strength boosts as well, that's a pretty big jump.

And, I can understand why WotC might have wanted to do this (let's make large creatures significantly more powerful than medium sized ones), but this opens the door for feat abuse and other abuse (e.g. the Spell Sword in my game exclusively uses two handed weapons one handed, just so that he can use large weapons and it gets worse when he Enlarges). IMO.

 

[Crothian]

Anyone not thinking this is a no-brainer is clearly not looking at the numbers, or not at the same ones.

The game is more then about numbers. I've yet to see a monk take this feat

 

[Infiniti2000]

The game is more then about numbers. I've yet to see a monk take this feat

Isn't that the assumption from the question though? If there question posed by this poll were merely about RP, what possible value would it be? I can't imagine this being a worthwhile poll if it weren't about the numbers. This feat is hands-down the most powerful feat for a monk. I mean, if you'd rather take skill focus (basketweaving) because it fits your character's background better, that's fine, but it's completely irrelevant from the intent of the poll. Am I right, Legildur?

 

[RigaMortus2]

I voted for YES, but I don't think it is a "no brainer". Not every monk needs to take INA. For some concepts, sure. I personally would probably take for almost any monk I would make, but that IMO doesn't necessarily make it a "no brainer".

That said, a Monk can not take INA anyway, so the point is moot

(Sorry, had to get it in there)