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Media Is Kickstarter ruining podcasts?

Leviatham

First Post
Recently Kickstarter was discussed in the Boardgame Geek website. As most BGG discussion, it was heated and it was intense. This time some people were claiming that Kickstarter is ruining podcasts because we only talk Kickstarter things these days.

It transpires that some people don’t like Kickstarter, regardless of podcasts or no podcasts involved. And it seems that those people are placing some weight on us, the podcasters, because it seems that, by giving airtime to Kickstarter projects, we are helping bring on the demise of the board-games industry.

So Doctor Reddy, aka the brains of the podcast and I, aka the beauty of the podcast, decided to spend a few minutes discussing our approach and our perceptions of Kickstarter and the influence in the gaming world.

http://gmsmagazine.podbean.com/mf/web/qume8w/podcast68.mp3
 

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Morrus

Well, that was fun
Staff member
10 years ago, were bank loans ruining podcasts?

Podcasts are talking about new gaming stuff, surely? If a lot of new gaming stuff is being funded via bank loans (as they were 10 years ago) or Kickstarter (as they are now), why does that matter?

Maybe just don't mention that this cool new book/game is benig funded via Kickstarter if the very word inflames the listeners so much. Just tell 'em book X is coming soon, like everyone always used to.
 

Leviatham

First Post
Oh, I agree. I can't see any problem with the way games are funded. Kickstarter has given a lot of companies a shot in the arm that was much needed.

What the thread claimed is that podcasts that cover too many Kickstarter projects are hurting the industry because it's all about the hype and then people can get disappointed with the game, thus losing confidence in both the gaming industry and the podcasts as well.
 

Agamon

Adventurer
I listen to 8 podcasts regularly concerning different interests, and I've only heard KS mentioned in passing, if at all. So no, I doubt this general statement is true.

I'm guessing you're right that some people just don't like KS and any mention of it is a bad thing for them.
 

jonesy

A Wicked Kendragon
Kickstarter has enjoyed major successes recently which have gotten a lot of popularity, which has increased Kickstarters popularity, so naturally people talk more about it. I still don't see it being all that in your face as its detractors are claiming, but I guess when you constantly look for something you keep seeing it.
 


Morrus

Well, that was fun
Staff member
What the thread claimed is that podcasts that cover too many Kickstarter projects are hurting the industry because it's all about the hype and then people can get disappointed with the game, thus losing confidence in both the gaming industry and the podcasts as well.
When is an upcoming product not all about the hype?

I think maybe these people object to marketing, not funding methods.
 

Mark CMG

Creative Mountain Games
When is an upcoming product not all about the hype?

I think maybe these people object to marketing, not funding methods.

Indeed. In a way, Kickstarter puts a lot of small providers on an equal footing with larger entities in that it allows for the pre-release attention the small providers (who might only put out one or two things a year) would love to have and that big entities have built into their marketing with every release. So, it turns out that Kickstarter is not simply a funding source but a marketing program. Folks who want to be cautious about new products can still wait for the actual product release and for some reviews to come out. Perhaps they don't trust themselves to not succumb to the marketing? In any event, there are so many podcasts and video shows and blogs on gaming at this point, it is worthwhile for there to be more light shed on products in the many pipelines so they all have something to kick about. ;)
 

Leviatham

First Post
When is an upcoming product not all about the hype?

I think maybe these people object to marketing, not funding methods.
Indeed. In a way, Kickstarter puts a lot of small providers on an equal footing with larger entities in that it allows for the pre-release attention the small providers (who might only put out one or two things a year) would love to have and that big entities have built into their marketing with every release. So, it turns out that Kickstarter is not simply a funding source but a marketing program. Folks who want to be cautious about new products can still wait for the actual product release and for some reviews to come out. Perhaps they don't trust themselves to not succumb to the marketing? In any event, there are so many podcasts and video shows and blogs on gaming at this point, it is worthwhile for there to be more light shed on products in the many pipelines so they all have something to kick about. ;)
I think you're both right here. First because it was some sort of novelty and now because it is a well followed platform, Kickstarter is a really good way to market your product, even if you don't really need the funding to launch it.

And Morrus is totally right, an upcoming product is all about the hype, whether it is a game or a new type of toilet paper.

Worth pointing out, though, that the thread I referred to is all about boardgames, not RPGs, and it seems that the boardgames crowd is a lot less permissive of change than we are.

Without having done any research and purely based on that thread and this one, it seems that the way Kickstarter is shaking the way boardgames are being produced and people are not used to that sort of change. Although boardgames are becoming mainstream (and it's a matter of a little time before they go mainstream full time) the funding, production methods and channels have remained pretty much unchanged until Kickstarter came into the scene.

Now one doesn't have to have a massively deep pocket to get something off the ground. The same person doesn't have to go the publishers. And that same person can ship the games.

The RPG industry has been doing that for yonks and we are in a much direr state than the boardgames industry, so for us Kickstarter is a welcome sight and full of potential, whereas for boardgames it threatens a lot of their models.

There is something else, and this is just me being cynical, so take it with a pinch of salt: I think boardgamers are annoyed that they get left behind.

If a game comes out in Kickstarter with a rather limited print-run, it happens to be a good game and then people can't get hold of it, they feel left behind.

Of course, this also happened before Kickstarter, but because it was a lot more difficult to hear about the game, you didn't care about what you didn't know. I'm sure no one complains that they can buy Alien Frontiers, Sunrise City or Fleet now that they're everywhere, even if they came from Kickstarter projects.

Toldyou I was being cynical!
 

frankthedm

First Post
Kickstarter is a problem because of all the spam in generates. Once someone signs up, there is a perverse incentive to generate spam at other centers of online communication in hopes of personal gain through increased pledge goals.

What ticks me off is when a kickstarter actively encourages it's backers to spam boards they are part of.
 

Crothian

First Post
Recently Kickstarter was discussed in the Boardgame Geek website. As most BGG discussion, it was heated and it was intense. This time some people were claiming that Kickstarter is ruining podcasts because we only talk Kickstarter things these days.
Kickstarters are not ruining podcasts; the podcasters are. It's up to them to decide what to talk about. If they choose to talk about kickstarters all the time and that ruins the podcast then there is no one to blame except the people doing the podcast.
 

Leviatham

First Post
Kickstarters are not ruining podcasts; the podcasters are. It's up to them to decide what to talk about. If they choose to talk about kickstarters all the time and that ruins the podcast then there is no one to blame except the people doing the podcast.
I guess the question is if actually covering Kickstarter constantly ruins podcasts.
 

Crothian

First Post
I guess the question is if actually covering Kickstarter constantly ruins podcasts.
Then it depends on how they cover them. If they are just reading the Kickstarter off of the website word for word (and I've listened to some podcasts that do that) then those people are making bad choices on how to do a podcast and I delete the podcast and never listen to them again. But if the podcasters take some time and talk intelligently about the project and give the listener more information then I could get from just reading the Kickstarter then they are doing a good job and I'd listen to their podcasts more. I haven't heard any podcasters that do that though.
 

ProtoClone

First Post
OK, I don't watch any podcasts so I don't have much to say on what is ruining them or not.

But, do the guys launching the Kickstarters get interviewed or is it just their potential products that get reviewed?
 

P

PaulofCthulhu

Guest
But if the podcasters take some time and talk intelligently about the project and give the listener more information then I could get from just reading the Kickstarter then they are doing a good job and I'd listen to their podcasts more. I haven't heard any podcasters that do that though.
We talked to Sandy Petersen recently (since he has a Kickstarter going at the moment).

http://www.yog-sothoth.com/content/1127-Sandy-Petersen-2012-Interview

and then we also talk about it in one of our shows:

http://www.yog-sothoth.com/content/1128-News-from-Pnakotus-035-Lo-Pan-Style

Essentially if you want to know more about a Kickstarter than what anyone can simply infer from reading the page, well, you'd just have to talk to the folks involved. This requires a lot more effort than just giving opinions and it's easy to understand why podcasters would just want to read & give their view in most circumstances.
 

gamerprinter

First Post
Kickstarter is a problem because of all the spam in generates. Once someone signs up, there is a perverse incentive to generate spam at other centers of online communication in hopes of personal gain through increased pledge goals.

What ticks me off is when a kickstarter actively encourages it's backers to spam boards they are part of.
I don't promote any of my non-KS stuff any less than the KS ones - I've got as many posts on these and other forums, no matter what method of funding was used for my given Kaidan setting and supplements. Really I've only got one product that used KS anyway, everything else was produced out of pocket.

Most of the KS threads I see on various forums aren't started by the project developers, rather fans and supporters listing what KS projects they find interesting or pertains to RPGs in general.

I don't see the difference between a Kickstarter funded project and a non-Kickstarter funded project?!

Kickstarter isn't a fad - it's a money source only. Kickstarter isn't a marketing program unless you're a regular KS visitor.
 
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Leviatham

First Post
But if the podcasters take some time and talk intelligently about the project and give the listener more information then I could get from just reading the Kickstarter then they are doing a good job and I'd listen to their podcasts more. I haven't heard any podcasters that do that though.
Allow me to give you a couple of links then! :)

http://www.gmsmagazine.com/podcasts/the-gms-magazine-podcast-episode-67magicians-with-kyle-simmons

http://www.gmsmagazine.com/podcasts...e-66horror-games-and-zombies-with-wj-mcguffin
 

Janx

Hero
Kickstarter is a problem because of all the spam in generates. Once someone signs up, there is a perverse incentive to generate spam at other centers of online communication in hopes of personal gain through increased pledge goals.

What ticks me off is when a kickstarter actively encourages it's backers to spam boards they are part of.
I think the Spam aspect is part of the turn-off.

In the old bank loan model, hearing about a product did not mean "help us by giving us money"

In the KS model, everytime somebody uses the word KickStarter when talking about their product, its a request to give them money.
 

gamerprinter

First Post
I think the Spam aspect is part of the turn-off.

In the old bank loan model, hearing about a product did not mean "help us by giving us money"

In the KS model, everytime somebody uses the word KickStarter when talking about their product, its a request to give them money.
True, but for KS RPG products (at least the one I was involved with) was more a pre-order of products, than "give me money". Some KS, especially non-RPG projects are more "give me money" than anything else.

But when I post an announcement of a product, even if funded out of pocket - the goal is that you'll be interested and pay money for it. Isn't that the same thing?
 

Morrus

Well, that was fun
Staff member
I think the Spam aspect is part of the turn-off.

In the old bank loan model, hearing about a product did not mean "help us by giving us money"

In the KS model, everytime somebody uses the word KickStarter when talking about their product, its a request to give them money.
That's a excellent point. I can't disagree with that.

But when I post an announcement of a product, even if funded out of pocket - the goal is that you'll be interested and pay money for it. Isn't that the same thing?
Well, hopefully you wouldn't be spamming about it, though.
 

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