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I finished running a game a few hours ago. I am using an Adventure Path. I did have to look up quite a few rules. I wish they would include all the stat blocks in the book rather than page 176 and page 294 for advanced templates to make my job easier. I like full stat blocks for everything but the absolute standard creature in my modules.
And yes, Pathfinder's rules are far more intimidating for your average player than 4E, especially for a DM. I note frustration in some of my players when they are trying to do something and some rules aspect messes them up. They are getting used to it now.
Then again the round to round modifiers made 4E DMing a huge pain for myself and my friend. It burned us out trying to track modifiers for five different players and all the different monsters. Then when the players started using dailies, then you have compounding modifiers to track and round to round saves. And all types of tiny little changes.
Then you had players doing what some wizard and caster players do with the one encounter adventure day. Instead of the wizard and cleric needing to rest a day to get their spells back, now the fighter, rogue, and socerer are willing to spend their time resting for a day to get their best powers back.
It all became a giant headache. Pathfinder's not perfect. But it sure suits my tastes and tolerance for bookkeeping a great deal more than 4E. My paper looked like I spoke in code with the little initial marks I had to make to keep track of marked and what was the sorcerer one? I can't even remember. But I'm glad to be done with all of that.
In Pathfinder the monster's swing their weapons. If they hit, they do damage. If they have some other effect, it lasts for a round or two period. You tell the player the modifier and how many rounds it lasts and you're done. No worrying about if the guy missed or not to reeastablish the mark or remarked a different target or got hit by the can't use your power ray or what not. So much easier to adjudicate as a DM.
I'll stop after this I promise
I too grew up on much the same as you did. I love the d20 system as a step up from the mayhem of 1E/AD&D days when everyone had different houserules. But what drives me nuts, even today, is not the over all game system, but how things are written for it. In 4E, everything I need is right there, I don't need to look up anything.
A first level adventure in Pathfinder I was DMing just the other night, I had to refer to the stat block in the adventure, which referred me to a creature in the beastiary, which had an ability that I had to look up in the core rulebook. Why!?!? That one thing alone makes it more difficult (and intimidating) for someone to want to step in and run.
Rules familiarity helps a lot with this... but seriously, look at that tome known as the core rulebook and tell me it isn't intimidating.
I for one cannot wait for the new starter set Paizo is constructing... I just wish they would draw on that one design principle from 4e and include everything you need in the freaking stat blocks so you don't have to search everywhere for information.
I finished running a game a few hours ago. I am using an Adventure Path. I did have to look up quite a few rules. I wish they would include all the stat blocks in the book rather than page 176 and page 294 for advanced templates to make my job easier. I like full stat blocks for everything but the absolute standard creature in my modules.
And yes, Pathfinder's rules are far more intimidating for your average player than 4E, especially for a DM. I note frustration in some of my players when they are trying to do something and some rules aspect messes them up. They are getting used to it now.
Then again the round to round modifiers made 4E DMing a huge pain for myself and my friend. It burned us out trying to track modifiers for five different players and all the different monsters. Then when the players started using dailies, then you have compounding modifiers to track and round to round saves. And all types of tiny little changes.
Then you had players doing what some wizard and caster players do with the one encounter adventure day. Instead of the wizard and cleric needing to rest a day to get their spells back, now the fighter, rogue, and socerer are willing to spend their time resting for a day to get their best powers back.
It all became a giant headache. Pathfinder's not perfect. But it sure suits my tastes and tolerance for bookkeeping a great deal more than 4E. My paper looked like I spoke in code with the little initial marks I had to make to keep track of marked and what was the sorcerer one? I can't even remember. But I'm glad to be done with all of that.
In Pathfinder the monster's swing their weapons. If they hit, they do damage. If they have some other effect, it lasts for a round or two period. You tell the player the modifier and how many rounds it lasts and you're done. No worrying about if the guy missed or not to reeastablish the mark or remarked a different target or got hit by the can't use your power ray or what not. So much easier to adjudicate as a DM.
