D&D (2024) Is the 5E player base going to split?

[teitan]

It's true that we are not the majority of players, but you can't speak for everyone else and don't know who it might matter to.

Yeah but continued sales success says who it matters to. That’s the bottom line. None of these companies are in it for the fans and when people quit thinking that way and realize the bones that are tossed on occasion are just fab service the disappointment will end. Even in the TSR days everyone made the same laments that are made about 5e. They will make them in 10e. Just like Warhammer and GW, people will always talk about the old days and it will be different for everyone while new people continue to chuck dice and as their hair greys they will become us and talk about how 9th edition 40K was the last time GW cared about the fans and the paint was so good because ten years ago everyone complained about the products they get all teary eyes about now.

 

[Gnarlo]

I think the term you're looking for is "inflation". It's kind of funny how people get stuck on specific price points for some things. Another good examples is video games - for whatever reason people don't expect to pay much more than $60 for even AAA games, a price point established around a decade or so ago. If they had kept pace with inflation [after a quick google search for inflation calculator], they'd be around $80.

Everything from wages for the people writing the product to the paper it's printed on to shipping costs have risen. I'm surprised it isn't higher.

Same thing with board games; when Hasbro reprinted Heroquest there was the expected gnashing of teeth and rending of garments on the forums from folks expecting it to be sold at the '89 price. Accounting for 30 years of inflation it was almost exactly the same price...

 

[Maxperson]

Yeah but continued sales success says who it matters to.

That's not true in the least. It's one aspect of the game. It can matter to you a lot and if you love the rest of the game, you will almost surely buy it. I have a huge issue with the 6-8 encounter adventuring day. It ALMOST ruins the game for me, but doesn't, so I continue to buy 5e products.

Continued sales say nothing about which areas of the game a customer may or may not have issues with.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

That's not true in the least. It's one aspect of the game. It can matter to you a lot and if you love the rest of the game, you will almost surely buy it. I have a huge issue with the 6-8 encounter adventuring day. It ALMOST ruins the game for me, but doesn't, so I continue to buy 5e products.

Continued sales say nothing about which areas of the game a customer may or may not have issues with.

I find 5e 'good enough' I like a lot of it. I love some of it... but I dislike some, and actively HATE some of it. However being the current supported game gives it a bit of a boost as well.

If 2024 came around and the new PHB was more like Basic D&D than 5e I don't think I would update to it.
If 2024 came around and the new PHB was written like a mash up of the TSR books and rifts (not the best) and the mechanics were more like 3.5 I would not only not update to it, but I would be very upset and vocal about it.
If 2024 came around and the new PHB was a 4e style game with every personal tweek I would want and better numbers a true merging of the best of 2e 4e and 5e using 4e as it's base... I would jump for joy be on here singing it's praises and buy not just physical books but online stuff to to run on roll20.

if (as I suspect) 2024 comes and they make a bunch of minor changes (like a 5.5) without addressing any of my more major concerns... I will be WAY less likely to update unless everyone I know is. even then it might just be the end of my D&D days.


this is were splits happen... my dream perfect edition would turn some off. my hated idea is EXACTLY what some want... there is no way to change things and not split the game

 

[James Gasik]

unless they increased modularity somehow, but...yeah that's not going to happen.

 

[teitan]

That's not true in the least. It's one aspect of the game. It can matter to you a lot and if you love the rest of the game, you will almost surely buy it. I have a huge issue with the 6-8 encounter adventuring day. It ALMOST ruins the game for me, but doesn't, so I continue to buy 5e products.

Continued sales say nothing about which areas of the game a customer may or may not have issues with.

You are missing my point then. We aren’t the audience. We are a minority. The customer base is different now, continued sales success to this different audience indicates that the game is going to continue in this direction whether we like it or not. I like 5e though so it’s neither here nor there but the current customer base likes the game and where it is going. You are a minority. I have my issues with it but can live with it like I have every version of the game.

 

[Malmuria]

I find 5e 'good enough' I like a lot of it. I love some of it... but I dislike some, and actively HATE some of it. However being the current supported game gives it a bit of a boost as well.

If 2024 came around and the new PHB was more like Basic D&D than 5e I don't think I would update to it.
If 2024 came around and the new PHB was written like a mash up of the TSR books and rifts (not the best) and the mechanics were more like 3.5 I would not only not update to it, but I would be very upset and vocal about it.
If 2024 came around and the new PHB was a 4e style game with every personal tweek I would want and better numbers a true merging of the best of 2e 4e and 5e using 4e as it's base... I would jump for joy be on here singing it's praises and buy not just physical books but online stuff to to run on roll20.

if (as I suspect) 2024 comes and they make a bunch of minor changes (like a 5.5) without addressing any of my more major concerns... I will be WAY less likely to update unless everyone I know is. even then it might just be the end of my D&D days.


this is were splits happen... my dream perfect edition would turn some off. my hated idea is EXACTLY what some want... there is no way to change things and not split the game

Let’s say that 5.5 comes out and that year they make a setting or adventure path or adventure collection that looks cool to you and that works with 5e characters? Would you not purchase it because the “current” edition is officially in the revised phb, and you prefer the original?

That’s somewhat a rhetorical question. If 5e players keep purchasing 5.5e content because they like it and it is compatible, then the player base is not split.

And what would make the new adventures incompatible? There’s encounter balance, except that that’s notoriously already broken in base 5e. There’s a mix of short rest and long rest classes…also present in base 5e. Etc.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Let’s say that 5.5 comes out and that year they make a setting or adventure path or adventure collection that looks cool to you and that works with 5e characters? Would you not purchase it because the “current” edition is officially in the revised phb, and you prefer the original?

again it depends on what they changed. in general if I choose not to update to the 2024 book I will not be buying additional products.

That’s somewhat a rhetorical question. If 5e players keep purchasing 5.5e content because they like it and it is compatible, then the player base is not split.

I mean if I buy an old 2e adventure (and one of my buddies just did buy like 3)and update it to 5e does that mean there is no split between people playing 2e and people playing 5e?

And what would make the new adventures incompatible?

I don't know... but I will revisit my crazy examples...

If 2024 came around and the new PHB was more like Basic D&D than 5e I don't think I would update to it.

in this case I can't imagine wanting to use a basic adventure as anything more then concept... so I would maybe get some online reviews and make my own.

If 2024 came around and the new PHB was written like a mash up of the TSR books and rifts (not the best) and the mechanics were more like 3.5 I would not only not update to it, but I would be very upset and vocal about it.

there is nothing WotC could publish that would get me to buy into such a game

If 2024 came around and the new PHB was a 4e style game with every personal tweek I would want and better numbers a true merging of the best of 2e 4e and 5e using 4e as it's base... I would jump for joy be on here singing it's praises and buy not just physical books but online stuff to to run on roll20.

I would buy every adventure

if (as I suspect) 2024 comes and they make a bunch of minor changes (like a 5.5) without addressing any of my more major concerns... I will be WAY less likely to update unless everyone I know is. even then it might just be the end of my D&D days.

this is the interesting "I don't know" answer. If as I suspect there is just enough change to make people buy the books but not enough to address system issues, I think I would be less likely to buy any adventures until the next edition.

There’s encounter balance, except that that’s notoriously already broken in base 5e.

it is almost to the point I can't imagine it being worse... I mean 'no advice' is almost better

There’s a mix of short rest and long rest classes…also present in base 5e. Etc.

this is one... if the new books remove 1 or both types of rest that could make adventures not backwards compatible.

 

[Malmuria]

mean if I buy an old 2e adventure (and one of my buddies just did buy like 3)and update it to 5e does that mean there is no split between people playing 2e and people playing 5e?

If you convert The Night Below to 5e, that you then run with 5e characters and rules, you are playing 5e. You’ve updated/converted. The player base is split only to the degree that there are still people playing using 2e (or 3e or 4e) rules.

But I was more looking at it from a commercial standpoint. If current 5e players can keep their core books, but use them with all the post-2024 supplements and adventures, and if 5e and 5.5 e characters can exist at the same table, then wotc has achieved their goal.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

If you convert The Night Below to 5e, that you then run with 5e characters and rules, you are playing 5e. You’ve updated/converted. The player base is split only to the degree that there are still people playing using 2e (or 3e or 4e) rules.

right... so if I buy Curse of strahd and run it on 2e or go buy tales of the spell jammer and run it in 4e, or I buy forge of fire and run it in 5e... there is still a split from 2e 3e 4e and 5e players

But I was more looking at it from a commercial standpoint. If current 5e players can keep their core books, but use them with all the post-2024 supplements and adventures, and if 5e and 5.5 e characters can exist at the same table, then wotc has achieved their goal.

but again how little has to change (and again I already said that is what I think they will try for) to make that possible? how many issues would they have to not fix?

as it is now we already have alot of changes causing splits