Is the D&D fanbase too divided?

[LordofIllusions]

All one need do is take a trip to flamer central(i.e. The Wizards of the Coast boards) to see how divided D&D has become. One would think that with all of the new books and options available in the game that it would improve the game, but it has not.

Most of the new supplements being put out for the game are not improving the social air of the game only further corrupting it by promoting selfishness in players as opposed to diplomacy and social skills. In this age of MMORPGs and video games it appears that some have forgotten what it means to actually "roleplay" a character. Do I think video games are guilty solely? No. I think some video games can be a great inspiration to the game....some. Yet I am speaking of gamers that spend hours sitting in front of their computer screen having little to no interaction with another breathing human being, other than the IMs that pop up on their messenger or chat boxes, whom then try to dictate how the game should be.

WotC does not seem to care what happens with D&D as long as profits are pouring in. I could be wrong but this is how I feel. One posters stated he may be leaving the hobby. I know tons of other gamers that feel the same. WotCs possible answer to this will be of course to rush another edition of the game out. Hopefully they are wiser than that and start to help improve the social air of the game without all of the player coddling they usually endorse.

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[maddman75]

WotC does not seem to care what happens with D&D as long as profits are pouring in.

They're a business. If they don't keep profits rolling in, they won't be able to make more books.

I'd advise you not to worry about the social air of gaming or whatever, just have fun with your friends.

 

[evildmguy]

Wow. I am curious as to what others have to say about this.

I can remember the last division was on game worlds, because the mechanics were pretty static. Now, with PrC's, feats, and skills, it's easy to divide people on the mechanic side as well.

I have noticed this in my gaming with d20. If a group has one Rules Laywer in it, it seems as if everyone needs to be a RL. (In the best world, that one RL would advise the rest.) When a group I had reached high levels, the RL's character was able to to cover several classes quite well, due to how he created his character. And it started making some of the other character seem less important.

I think the best thing a GM can do is to state up front what books will be used and not change that for the course of the campaign. That way, everyone knows and can work toward whatever equally. (Hmm. Is that the "elusive" 1E/2E feel that I still don't understand?)

Take care.

edg

 

[LordofIllusions]

They're a business. If they don't keep profits rolling in, they won't be able to make more books.

I own a business too, but I also care about my customers.

I'd advise you not to worry about the social air of gaming or whatever, just have fun with your friends.

Having fun with your friends, while playing D&D, is a social activity that takes place during gaming.

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[Crothian]

Huh? You lost me by saying that books are "promoting selfishness".

I can agree that the D&D fanbase is divided between 1e, 3.X, C&C, hackmaster, True20, and other systems that want to be D&D. I can also see one claiming that the different settings divide the fanbase.

How do the books force people to sit in front of their computer not interacting with people? I don't see how you coming to that conclusion either. I see a lot of smoke in your post but no fire.

 

[evildmguy]

WotC does not seem to care what happens with D&D as long as profits are pouring in.

I can't speak for sure but after meeting some of the designers at cons, they seem to really care that they put out a quality product that people are going to enjoy and use. And if they succeed in that, profits will follow.

I could be wrong.

edg

 

[LordofIllusions]

Huh? You lost me by saying that books are "promoting selfishness".

The focus is on new feats, new classes, new PrCs. Drop and play stuff focused on the one character as opposed to roleplaying which can benefit the group as a whole.

I can agree that the D&D fanbase is divided between 1e, 3.X, C&C, hackmaster, True20, and other systems that want to be D&D. I can also see one claiming that the different settings divide the fanbase.

Valid point.

How do the books force people to sit in front of their computer not interacting with people? I don't see how you coming to that conclusion either. I see a lot of smoke in your post but no fire.

The books don't force people to sit in front of their computers. I never said that.

I did imply that the isolationist activities that many so-called "roleplayers" engage in today, and subsequently bring with them to the gaming table, only serve to take away from the social base of D&D. Interacting with someone in an MMORPG is not the same as interacting with flesh and blood human beings sitting right in front of you.

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[LordofIllusions]

Wow. I am curious as to what others have to say about this.

I can remember the last division was on game worlds, because the mechanics were pretty static. Now, with PrC's, feats, and skills, it's easy to divide people on the mechanic side as well.

I have noticed this in my gaming with d20. If a group has one Rules Laywer in it, it seems as if everyone needs to be a RL. (In the best world, that one RL would advise the rest.) When a group I had reached high levels, the RL's character was able to to cover several classes quite well, due to how he created his character. And it started making some of the other character seem less important.

I think the best thing a GM can do is to state up front what books will be used and not change that for the course of the campaign. That way, everyone knows and can work toward whatever equally. (Hmm. Is that the "elusive" 1E/2E feel that I still don't understand?)

Take care.

edg

Thanks for your input on the matter.

~~~

 

[JustinA]

Most of the new supplements being put out for the game are not improving the social air of the game only further corrupting it by promoting selfishness in players as opposed to diplomacy and social skills. In this age of MMORPGs and video games it appears that some have forgotten what it means to actually "roleplay" a character. Do I think video games are guilty solely? No. I think some video games can be a great inspiration to the game....some. Yet I am speaking of gamers that spend hours sitting in front of their computer screen having little to no interaction with another breathing human being, other than the IMs that pop up on their messenger or chat boxes, whom then try to dictate how the game should be.

What, exactly, is your thesis here? Is it that WotC publishing supplements of D&D is making people impolite? Is it that MMORPGs make people impolite? Some sort of eldritch combination of the two stirring alchemical hatred into the Great Pan-Dimensional Society of Gamers?

The focus is on new feats, new classes, new PrCs. Drop and play stuff focused on the one character as opposed to roleplaying which can benefit the group as a whole.

This would appear to be a false dichotomy. The fact that Aragorn is really cool with his Heir of Destiny prestige class doesn't mean that a group has to become bitterly divided against itself. After all, Gandalf has his nifty White Mage prestige class and Second Coming feat. And Frodo over there has a magical ring designed with Weapons of Legacy (the penalties are a doozy).

Here's the thing: Rules are tools.

Let's say that again, just to make sure we've got it:

Rules are tools.

"Screwdrivers are the herald of doom for carpentry! Can't we all just use hammers?"

I suppose. But I like my screwdriver. I also like my level, my tape measure, and my power saw.

And, sure, there are poorly designed rules out there. There are even rules so poorly designed that it's like buying a screwdriver with razor blades set into the handle, but the solution to that is to simply not use that razor-bladed screwdriver.

I can remember the last division was on game worlds, because the mechanics were pretty static. Now, with PrC's, feats, and skills, it's easy to divide people on the mechanic side as well.

Remember kits? Remember Players' Option? I suspect there's some rose-colored glasses involved in this assessment.

 

[Crothian]

The focus is on new feats, new classes, new PrCs. Drop and play stuff focused on the one character as opposed to roleplaying which can benefit the group as a whole.

I don't know. But the right prestige class can really help to defeat that BBEG and let the group survive that encounter. A TPK sure doesn't help the group. I imagine WotC are giving the majority of their fans what they want. D&D has never really had much on the roleplaying aspect of the game. It just is not what the system focuses on for better or for worse.

I did imply that the isolationist activities that many so-called "roleplayers" engage in today only serve to take away from the social base of D&D. Interacting with someone in an MMORPG is not the same as interacting with flesh and blood human beings sitting right in front of you.

D&D isn't a MMORPG though so this doesn't matter to the topic at hand. Unless you are implying D&D somehow shares those same qualities. And if you are I would want an explanation on that becasue I don't see that.