Is there a non-magic paladin or a paladin with Chr based spells?

[DM-Rocco]

If you read threads from people who have actually used it, most folks agree it's not abusive at all. It's mostly folks who just read it and don't consider all the ramifications (which is hard to do until you play it) that conclude it's overpowered. There are a LOT of playing reports about the book, and I suggest you at least read those before coming to a conclusion.

Hey, it is my opinion. Not my theory but my experience. I have seen other players in our group use it and I have seen them abuse it. You could counter with, "but you didn't play it," but I don't have to when I see how it effected the game I was in. Now, it is not broken, the way pun pun is, but you can do a lot of interesting things that the DM banned right off the bat.

Sorry you don't like my opinion, I will try to change to make you happier

 

[Mistwell]

Hey, it is my opinion. Not my theory but my experience. I have seen other players in our group use it and I have seen them abuse it. You could counter with, "but you didn't play it," but I don't have to when I see how it effected the game I was in. Now, it is not broken, the way pun pun is, but you can do a lot of interesting things that the DM banned right off the bat.

Sorry you don't like my opinion, I will try to change to make you happier

Ok the fact that you had read the class and seen it in play in your group is a direct contradiction to you saying "I'll check that out too. I'll have to stop by our local hobby shop, I don't have that book either" just last night. If you knew all about that class, then why did you reply that you needed to go check it out?

Anyway, glad you checked it out and decided based on actual play. I know it's not for everybody, but it bugs me when people dismiss an entire book based on rumors and a quick glance without actually trying it in play.

 

[Nadaka]

How exactly is a crusader wuxia/kung fu in flavor? It is a holy warrior who focuses on smiting foes and healing/boosting allies in battle. How is that not the same flavor as a paladin.

The warblade doesn't even really have that flavor either. It can be just as much about martial prowess and raw power as any fighter or barbarian.

The swordsage, yep they are ninja's with supernatural powers. I agree, they are the least "pseudo-medieval-European" of the classes.

 

[Thurbane]

Oh heck no. You crap this thread and then expect nobody to respond in this thread? How about maybe you start another thread to rant about it instead of telling some guy who says he is open to alternative Paladins from WOTC that he shouldn't even consider a suggestion because it's not your cup of tea?

Well, I didn't want to mess up the OPs thread with the same old B09S arguments we've both seen a thousand times. :\

Suffice to say if you read what I posted properly, you'd see I was offering him my own opinion...I can't see where offering my opinion to someone who hasn't read a book is a bad thing.

Speaking for myself, I love to hear what someone thinks of a book before I go out and buy it. YMMV.

 

[Thurbane]

D&D is headed this way, and they have already said it is. It was one of the most popular books they put out, and for good reason. It really is a superior system. Not an overpowered system, just a much better and more interesting one.

See, now you're doing what you acccused me of...offering up opinion as if it's fact. Difference is, I made it abundantly clear that my post was nothing but opinion.

I don't mean to sound like I'm looking for an argument - I actually respect you as a poster and in 90% of cases on these forums agree with your posts. Perhaps we should just agree to disagree on Bo9S and be amicable about it?

 

[Zurai]

Difference is, I made it abundantly clear that my post was nothing but opinion.

You also came in with a chip on your shoulder the size of Manhattan. Don't try to pretend you're a victim here. You stirred the cauldron just as much as anyone else.

 

[Mistwell]

See, now you're doing what you acccused me of...offering up opinion as if it's fact. Difference is, I made it abundantly clear that my post was nothing but opinion.

That part was obviously my opinion.

Your part was as well, and I was not calling you to task for offering an opinion. I was calling you to task for saying nobody should respond to your opinion in this thread, and would have to start a new thread to respond to you. The purpose of you offering the opinion was, I assume, for persuasive reasons. Given that context, people who disagree with you should respond in kind in this thread for the same motivation.

I don't mean to sound like I'm looking for an argument - I actually respect you as a poster and in 90% of cases on these forums agree with your posts. Perhaps we should just agree to disagree on Bo9S and be amicable about it?

I'm down with that! And for the record, I dig your posts 95% of the time as well

 

[Thurbane]

Cheers Mistwell.

You also came in with a chip on your shoulder the size of Manhattan. Don't try to pretend you're a victim here. You stirred the cauldron just as much as anyone else.

LOL - I'm hardly playing the victim. I expressed an opinion, which I'm hardly about to apologize for. Perhaps I was a bit OTT with the way I worded my post, and for that I do apologize. But my underlying opinion remains intact.

...in either case, there are some fine suggestions above for the OP with alternatives for his character concept. I must admit, it's been a long time since I played a Paladin, and this thread has got me very interested in trying out a new one.

 

[DM-Rocco]

The Paladin variant from Complete Champion would be perfect, IMO. It works great.

Dragon magazine #349 (p. 93) offers a bunch of fiendslaying options for Paladins, some of which are quite cool (again, IMO.)

And your first bunch of stats should be fine there. Though personally, I might go for Dex 12 and Str 15, if not more so.


edit --- 349, not 359.

Hey, I finally found that issue. I love all of those and I think I will go that way, specially since it will be a magic light world so the Celestial weapon is great. Thanks for the heads up.

 

[DM-Rocco]

Cheers Mistwell.

LOL - I'm hardly playing the victim. I expressed an opinion, which I'm hardly about to apologize for. Perhaps I was a bit OTT with the way I worded my post, and for that I do apologize. But my underlying opinion remains intact.

...in either case, there are some fine suggestions above for the OP with alternatives for his character concept. I must admit, it's been a long time since I played a Paladin, and this thread has got me very interested in trying out a new one.

For the record I love opinions, I just hate when people tell me I have to do something. I thought you offered an opinion as I thought Mistwell offered me his opinion. I happened not to share the same opinion as Mistwell, but I am sure I have agreed with him in the past on something else.

Its all good. Children, go back to playing

I haven't played a paladin in forever either so I am looking forward to this. Should be fun since their is already one paladin in the party and the group is all good. That makes is easier to play a paladin without getting into fighters with the rogue ro the wizard/necromancer