Is there demand for a “tactical” RPG akin to 4e?

[uzirath]

One problem with this thread is that between Gubat Banwa, Icon, and Fabula Ultimate, my TTRPG reading list has become full and I’m not sure where to start.

Yes! I'm very excited about Gubat Banwa, but one of the PDFs is 500+ pages. That's a lot more reading than I usually do on a screen and too much to print. I'm hoping for a book at some point.

 

[Thunderfoot]

So I'm not a fan of 4e. I say this only so that you understand that I'm sincerely trying to help.

So, one of the issues that 4e had was that it was more wargame than RPG and I think that's probably more what you are looking for, the difference is you are looking for squad based tactics versus army tactics. My suggestion is to check out Chainmail from the 90s. It was the pre-cursor to the D&D minis collectables and was a solid game.

Also you may want to use a game like Squad Leader and pulp the crap out of it to make a fantasy re-hash. Probably not what you were imagining, but hopefully it will open doors that were otherwise shut. Best of luck.

 

[Lionblade]

So I'm not a fan of 4e. I say this only so that you understand that I'm sincerely trying to help.

So, one of the issues that 4e had was that it was more wargame than RPG and I think that's probably more what you are looking for, the difference is you are looking for squad based tactics versus army tactics. My suggestion is to check out Chainmail from the 90s. It was the pre-cursor to the D&D minis collectables and was a solid game.

Also you may want to use a game like Squad Leader and pulp the crap out of it to make a fantasy re-hash. Probably not what you were imagining, but hopefully it will open doors that were otherwise shut. Best of luck.

Thanks for the reply. A couple things:
1. I’m pretty sure Chainmail was released in the early 70s (not 90s) and bears little resemblance to D&D. I think D&D evolved from it as answer to “What if we played as a singular hero and not an army?”

2. I’m more just trying to see if there is interest in a 4e spiritual successor. 4e D&D is still D&D, but with significant changes made to character progression, skills, mechanics, etc. It just so happens these changes call for a more tactical/grid-and-minis style of play than maybe prior editions did.

That being said, I’m not interested so much in a straight 4e clone - though, that would be interesting if a popular one was around that ALSO didn’t draw the ire of WoTC lawyers.

 

[Thunderfoot]

Thanks for the reply. A couple things:
1. I’m pretty sure Chainmail was released in the early 70s (not 90s) and bears little resemblance to D&D. I think D&D evolved from it as answer to “What if we played as a singular hero and not an army?”

2. I’m more just trying to see if there is interest in a 4e spiritual successor. 4e D&D is still D&D, but with significant changes made to character progression, skills, mechanics, etc. It just so happens these changes call for a more tactical/grid-and-minis style of play than maybe prior editions did.

That being said, I’m not interested so much in a straight 4e clone - though, that would be interesting if a popular one was around that ALSO didn’t draw the ire of WoTC lawyers.

The Original Chainmail rules, which were a squad based tactics versus Army tactics rule set created by Keyes and Gygax, yes came out in the 70s but there was a reissued game that launched at about the same time as 3e.

 

[Lionblade]

The Original Chainmail rules, which were a squad based tactics versus Army tactics rule set created by Keyes and Gygax, yes came out in the 70s but there was a reissued game that launched at about the same time as 3e.

Strange… if that’s the case I’m not seeing any record of it anywhere: Chainmail (game) - Wikipedia

TSR acquired Chainmail and released a 3rd Edition in 1975. But also, TSR was acquired by WotC in the 90s and then they released D&D 3rd Edition, and TSR was then defunct.

If a 4th edition of Chainmail came out at the same time, it must have been a fan-made version now lost to time.

Edit: Also, 3e came out in 2000 I think, or around there?

 

[Thunderfoot]

Strange… if that’s the case I’m not seeing any record of it anywhere: Chainmail (game) - Wikipedia

TSR acquired Chainmail and released a 3rd Edition in 1975. But also, TSR was acquired by WotC in the 90s and then they released D&D 3rd Edition, and TSR was then defunct.

If a 4th edition of Chainmail came out at the same time, it must have been a fan-made version now lost to time.

Edit: Also, 3e came out in 2000 I think, or around there?

Nope, never take wikipedia for absolute truth. WotC released a revamped Chainmail game in 2000. Not fan based, not fan made. I've been playing since 1978, trust me I was there when they dropped 3e at the newly minted WotC store. Still have my Redgar the Fighter T-shirt from the newly re-designed RPGA launch (now Adventure's League). Chainmail re-launch was to pay homage to the game that started it all and to give minis rules to the more tactically enabled 3e. The minis game wasn't really needed and as a stand alone Warhammer amd Heroclix had out outclassed and out fanned, which is why they morphed into the D&D minis line.

 

[Lionblade]

Nope, never take wikipedia for absolute truth. WotC released a revamped Chainmail game in 2000. Not fan based, not fan made. I've been playing since 1978, trust me I was there when they dropped 3e at the newly minted WotC store. Still have my Redgar the Fighter T-shirt from the newly re-designed RPGA launch (now Adventure's League). Chainmail re-launch was to pay homage to the game that started it all and to give minis rules to the more tactically enabled 3e. The minis game wasn't really needed and as a stand alone Warhammer amd Heroclix had out outclassed and out fanned, which is why they morphed into the D&D minis line.

Ah, I see now. Is that this? Dungeons & Dragons Chainmail

I never got into this back in the 3e day but vaguely remember it.

In any case, I was looking more for an actively supported game… or to learn if there is interest in one.

 

[Thunderfoot]

Ah, I see now. Is that this? Dungeons & Dragons Chainmail

I never got into this back in the 3e day but vaguely remember it.

In any case, I was looking more for an actively supported game… or to learn if there is interest in one.

Gotcha. And yes, that would be the one. Trying ti fond a supported one is going to be a stretch because frankly, nerds and geeks like to divide into camps when it comes to their hobbies. lol I never understood it, but it's been happening since the late 70s/early 80s. Before that just being a nerd was divisive enough.

 

[Jd Smith1]

I keep hearing a lot about Zweihander- it sounds pretty cool!

We're 11 session in, and the system is amazing.

 

[jdrakeh]

Yes. People are playing things like Frostgrave as pseudo-RPGs, so the desire is there.