Ken Hite Re: The RPG Industry

[Ranger REG]

As I understand it, the reason they scrapped those features from MasterTools was that Hasbro sold the computer game rights to D&D to Infogrames, which meant they no longer had the rights to do that. Unfortunately, Fluid had spent a whole lot of effort on that part (I recall posts on the Master Tools mailing list where they bragged about how they had made different sound effects for all sorts of critters) instead of on the meat & potatoes of the product, the actual character generator.

I agree. Personally, I can do without them fancy souffle that takes at least an hour to cook for the desert course. All I care was the main course.

Master/E Tools would probably be a good example to put in a textbook on software development. An example of how NOT to do it, that is.

Hopefully, that's what Code Monkey Publishing is working on for their RPG Toolkit ... of course, I could do without the unnecessary "can take in all rulesystems" feature.

 

[DragonGames]

I also can see the trend to online & PDF purchases, and I have done that as well. However, there is still something to being able to hold a new product in your hands, maybe leaf through it before buying it and walking in to the local FLGS and discovering a game or supplament that I didn't know was out. Now, I have recently purchased a brick & mortar FLGS, so perhaps I am a bit biased. Our biggest seller is CCGs, but the money from them enables us to carry the less profitable RPG books. Plus, with our store, we hope that some customers will pay a little more to not only support a local business, but also because of our friendliness and the fact that we have ample gaming space and stay open until 1am on Fridays and Saturdays. We are a small store and we can't compete with the buying power of Amazon or Walmart. But being smaller, we can offer more personal service and we benefit from the fact that we ARE gamers. We know and like what we do. When you ask what the THAC0 is for a level 20 Paladin is, we may not know it off hand, but we know where to look. We also know that you are likely playing 2nd edition D&D and that you might be interested in some of the used 2nd ed books we just got in the other day. Is this worth a buck or two more on your game book purchase? We hope you think it is. But I do understand if someone goes to Amazon or grabs a PDF. The thing I hope never happens is that so many people go online for their stuff that we will have to close our doors. Losing a FLGS not only removes the products they carry from the local economy, but it takes away a gaming area and a hub for meeting local players.

 

[Mycanid]

Well Hairfoot, I must admit that I do agree with you in the sense that I could see such a possibility coming to pass. But it is, of course, only a possibility.

I guess I just have more faith in the old TT interface and that it will show itself to be the more potent ... err ... "user interface" over time.

It's kinda hard to guess where things will go. I mean, who woulda thought in 1984 that the Dragonlance fiction would begin to catapault DnD into a more acceptable public light? But there's nothing wrong with guessing ... when your livlihood does not depend upon it perhaps. Dragongames probably needs to have a clearer picture of where things are going, perhaps. Hmm....

Well, I'm beginning to meander here. Still, I have faith in the TT interface.

 

[Felon]

Might we share with the unenlightened who Ken Hite is, what his credentials are, and perhaps provide a URL to where his screed originated?

 

[Hussar]

Mycanid - I'm sure that tabletop will never die. I certainly hope not.

But, I think that as the technology advances, playing over the internet can be a very good substitute. Particularly for older gamers who don't have the time to hunt down gaming groups. There's already a thread upforum talking about how a guy moving to Ottawa can't find a game. Numerous other people have chimed in to commiserate. I can fully understand that considering that there are no gamers within driving distance of where I live in Japan.

Instead of being seen as competition, it would serve the industry well to support online gaming and to try to bring in gamers that way. Look at the huge number of people who play cards on Yahoo. A game of cards is hardly a difficult thing to arrange among friends, yet, we still see thousands of people playing Cribbage on Yahoo.

Probably the biggest hurdle to online gaming is books. In a TT group, not everyone will own every book, yet, most of the gamers will share their books. Player A buys Supplement X, shows it to his DM and plays his new character. This doesn't work when your DM is on another continent.

I'm not sure how to work around that - perhaps some form of DRM material that is unlocked through the use of the chat platform. But, that, right now, is a big hurdle to get around.

OTOH, it does entice gamers to buy more books as well. If Bob has cool new book X, then maybe everyone else will want to get a copy in the online game since they can't very easily share the book.

 

[Felon]

Remember when gaming was a weird little cottage industry that operated out of tiny little shops on the fringe and you were lucky to see so much as a Monster Manual in a mainstream bookstore? Remember when gaming supplements were laid out by copy'n'paste and printed in two colors?

I'm always amused by these "sky's falling" posts about the RPG industry. The RPG industry is HUGE and FILLED TO THE BRIM WITH MONEY compared to when I first got into the hobby.

I guess the difference between today and twenty-fire years ago is that today there's a general consensus that the entity known as the independently-owned, disenfranchised mom-n'-pop store selling niche goods for humble profits is no longer viable. I'm not sure why exactly.

I guess it's linked to an even greater mystery. Somewhere in the 1990's it was decided in the comics industry that it was no longer viable to produce comics cheaply on low-grade paper in a four-color format. Everything now has to be published on glossy paper with 32-billion color interiors. You pay four bucks for a story that you can read in ten minutes. And not only do people in the industry bemoan the decline of sales, but nobody even contemplates going back to the old ways.

The same thinking has infected D&D. I have copies of softbound TSR D&D books and issues of Dragon and Dungeon magazine from the late 1980's that I still enjoy reading; I'm not sure that I'm any more eager to part with my cash to buy them now than I was then. If Paizo could save me a buck by producing their mags more cheaply, I'd probably be more likely to purchase them, not less. There's nothing wrong with black-and-white art. In some ways, it's more evocative.

 

[catsclaw227]

And conversely, it would be an interesting idea if Dragon or Dungeon were offered in PDF only formats for download. I wonder how many subscribers would jump on this?

 

[mmadsen]

I guess the difference between today and twenty-fire years ago is that today there's a general consensus that the entity known as the independently-owned, disenfranchised mom-n'-pop store selling niche goods for humble profits is no longer viable. I'm not sure why exactly.

It's much, much more efficient to sell niche goods over the Internet or through a big-box store. Just remember that a product that cost $15 in 1980 would cost $38 in 2005 just due to inflation.

Somewhere in the 1990's it was decided in the comics industry that it was no longer viable to produce comics cheaply on low-grade paper in a four-color format. Everything now has to be published on glossy paper with 32-billion color interiors. You pay four bucks for a story that you can read in ten minutes. And not only do people in the industry bemoan the decline of sales, but nobody even contemplates going back to the old ways.

Somewhere in the 1990s, comic publishers realized they weren't selling to kids with no income and a casual interest in comics; they were selling to young men who were dedicated fans, and who were willing to pay more for a higher-quality product.

The same thinking has infected D&D. I have copies of softbound TSR D&D books and issues of Dragon and Dungeon magazine from the late 1980's that I still enjoy reading; I'm not sure that I'm any more eager to part with my cash to buy them now than I was then. If Paizo could save me a buck by producing their mags more cheaply, I'd probably be more likely to purchase them, not less. There's nothing wrong with black-and-white art. In some ways, it's more evocative.

I like softcovers with black-and-white art too, but that doesn't mean they're profitable.

 

[ColonelHardisson]

And conversely, it would be an interesting idea if Dragon or Dungeon were offered in PDF only formats for download. I wonder how many subscribers would jump on this?

Not that many, I'd suspect, and you'd lose all the people who buy them at shops or at bookstores or newsstands. Matter of fact, of late I've been able to get my copies of both at Barnes & Noble before they show up at game stores. PDF only? I doubt I'd buy them at all, except in rare cases.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Somewhere in the 1990's it was decided in the comics industry that it was no longer viable to produce comics cheaply on low-grade paper in a four-color format.

Somewhere in the 1990s, comic publishers realized they weren't selling to kids with no income and a casual interest in comics; they were selling to young men who were dedicated fans, and who were willing to pay more for a higher-quality product.

You missed out on a particularly important factor.

Somewhere in the late 80's, early 90's, the collectible market boomed. Not just comics, I mean ALL collectibles- comics, toys, etc. There were even articles in the New York Times and Wall Street Journal discussing the viability of collectibles as investment instruments.

And this market dynamic was largely driven by boomers.

Result for comics: limited edition covers. Prestige format mini-series. The "Death of Superman" story arc with a final issue jumping in price from a few dollars to $200 within minutes (I know because I saw it personally in Austin).