D&D 5E (2014) Kender are a core race?

[DMZ2112]

And of course, no one remembers the Marak kender, who were the most terrifying halflings on the Prime Material until Dark Sun launched.

 

[Li Shenron]

I really appreciate that in the current playtest packet, all races beyond the core 4 are under the "unusual races" section, with short explanation on why it is so (the current text is perfect for me).

If they do the same in the core books, I will easily accept any race there, including my most hated Warforged and Dragonborn.

As for Kenders specifically, I've never played Dragonlance and never see a kender PC before, therefore I'm not "fed up" with them yet. I actually find the current Kender very interesting as a PC, and I'd be willing to allow it even in another setting. Do I understand right that people have issues with Kenders because they steal stuff from other PCs? Because this I would never allow in my game! I have learned a long time ago that "no attacking or stealing from fellow party member" is the best house rule you can enforce in your game! But as a matter of fact, the current Kender description doesn't say that Kenders steal from others, just that they pick up random objects along the way. You can easily allow their "Kender Pockets" ability without ever having to worry about how they came up with those items, and without ever making specific items disappear first.

 

[Leatherhead]

Kenders are the signature Dragonlance race.

I thought Draconians were the iconic Dragonlance race?

 

[Dausuul]

I thought Draconians were the iconic Dragonlance race?

Well, we've got those too. (Yeah, yeah, I know, dragonborn aren't draconians... except for both being humanoid, human-sized dragon-people bred for warfare. Whatever.)

This doesn't really bother me. The introduction calls out kender as being unique to Krynn, so you've got a ready answer to any player who starts agitating to be one; the rules specifically say if you're not playing in Krynn, no kender. Ideally, these races would be in the DMG rather than the PHB, presented as examples of custom race design for the benefit of the DM.

 

[Kobold Stew]

.. or the back of the MM, with goblinoids, kobolds, orcs, and other "monster" races, for those who want them.

 

[DEFCON 1]

Some of us are incapable of doing this for reasons other than the contents of our collective scrota, DEFCON. Either we run public games in support of a game store, or we don't have enough players in our neighborhoods for us to be selective.

If you are running a public game and not your own campaign... then it shouldn't matter what the players are playing. So you have no need to allow or disallow any races. And if your neighborhood is so lacking in D&D games, but yet a player would QUIT your game because you wouldn't allow him to play a kender (or some other race you disallowed), that person isn't worth having in your game to begin with and you're lucky to be rid of him.

Neither of those reasons justify WotC scratching entire sections of the book out that might've been good for everybody else who plays the game. They are not writing their book to placate those two incredibly small segments of obnoxiously entitled players.

 

[DEFCON 1]

And what if I'm not the GM? Yeah, I can just leave, but who wants to be put in that position in the first place?

If it's not your game, you have no say in what the other players are playing if the GM is fine with it for his campaign. If he wants to allow kender in his Forgotten Realm game... then you either discuss it with both of them, you deal with it, or you choose not to play.

But it's not up to WotC to not include options in their books because you're unwilling to do that.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

As for Kenders specifically, I've never played Dragonlance and never see a kender PC before, therefore I'm not "fed up" with them yet. I actually find the current Kender very interesting as a PC, and I'd be willing to allow it even in another setting. Do I understand right that people have issues with Kenders because they steal stuff from other PCs? Because this I would never allow in my game! I have learned a long time ago that "no attacking or stealing from fellow party member" is the best house rule you can enforce in your game! But as a matter of fact, the current Kender description doesn't say that Kenders steal from others, just that they pick up random objects along the way. You can easily allow their "Kender Pockets" ability without ever having to worry about how they came up with those items, and without ever making specific items disappear first.

Kender, as presented in the original Dragonlance, did not just steal from other PCs, they'd steal from anyone. NPCs tend to react angrily to being "robbed". Even if the other PCs are talking to them, trying to make deals or otherwise acting in a sane manner. Outright banning kender from entering the castle or your house seems perfectly sensible.

If you had a player, playing a rogue, who kept stealing stuff, getting caught sometimes, getting tossed into jail and maybe getting the rest of the PCs in trouble, at some point (hopefully soon!) either the DM will tell the player to stop being a jerk, or the other PCs will ensure they don't do it again.

That doesn't work with an original kender though, as they're "playing their character" which actually required this, and telling them not to do that doesn't work (it's unconscious theft that the kender has no control over), and even threatening doesn't work (original kender are outright immune to fear).

The good news is the new kender isn't strictly required to do that kind of nonsense, but that stuff in the pockets has to come from somewhere... Someone with no familiarity with original kender probably isn't going to worry about that, but someone familiar with the old klepto kender would.

 

[Li Shenron]

...

The good news is the new kender isn't strictly required to do that kind of nonsense, but that stuff in the pockets has to come from somewhere... Someone with no familiarity with original kender probably isn't going to worry about that, but someone familiar with the old klepto kender would.

It looks hard to have a PC like that in the group, I wonder how people managed to play Dragonlance. Or was it just more common to have no kender in the group?

From the point of view of someone unaware of the setting, I can say that from the description in the playtest packet I could not figure out what you just explained about kender. My perspective is of course "here's some optional race, should I add it to my homebrew/casual campaign of D&D?". Without knowing what you just explained, I would have actually just allowed someone to play a kender and told her/him not to worry about explaining where does all the stuff comes from, it just happens to have a chance to be in your pocket

 

[delericho]

I'd much rather not have setting-specific races in the Core Rulebooks, thanks. If I'm not playing in that setting, I don't want to use them and would rather the space be used for something else. If I am using the setting, then including just one of the races from the setting is of little value to me - what if I want a Shifter instead of a Warforged, or a Minotaur instead of a Kender?