D&D General Kobold Press Going Down a Dark Road

[GMforPowergamers]

Then what terms would you use?

edition... or version all D&D and as such the same game.

If 2e and 3e are editions, it seems wildly inaccurate/confusing to call 3.5e or Bo9S an edition.

they are all D&D so the same game, 2e 3e and 3.5 are all different editions of the game (by any use we used prior to last year when wotc tried to redefine edition) Bo9S is a splat book optional add on to the 3.5 edition.

However, it seems wise to me to use the more standard term of edition for revisions to an existing book/game that is otherwise fundamentally the same. Then you need something else for major overhauls like 3e, 4e, & 5e. I was saying game, but maybe there is a better term.

again the game is D&D... it never changes the edition does, and the optional add ons do.

so D&D (game) 5e (edition) useing all the books (what add and options avalibul)
or D&D (game) 3e (edition) phb only (what add on and options)
or D&D (game) 1d&D (edition) phb plus 1 splat of your choice (what add on and options)
or D&D (game) 2e (edition) darksun modifications plus psionic handbook and barbarian handbook (what add on options)
or D&D (game) 4e (edition) PHB 1 &2 and the swordmage from forgotten realm book only (add on and options)

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Funny. You can give people more than one thing, and you don't have cater exclusively to the most popular options.

this too...

if I put out 4 books over 4 years (most likely more but not counting adventure and setting) and 1 only apeals to 50% of the players and 2 appeals to 80+% and 1 appeals to almost all the players from a game stand point it makes a much better more fun game to do that... from a money point of view that 50% book is a waste to publish.

 

[mamba]

In fact, I kind of wish folks would start a new thread to talk about all of these issues

looks like the Kobold statement was not that controversial after all

 

[Micah Sweet]

Yes, and previous editions did alot of the latter...

Edit: Also im sure they know they can't please everyone but if something doesn't resonate with the majority of your market... why would you spend the money and dedicate the resources developing it when you can focus those on products that do resonate with the majority... this is business 101.

But it's not game design 101. So we know what comes first.

 

[Bolares]

But it's not game design 101. So we know what comes first.

yes, what I personally want them to do.

 

[TwoSix]

I use 3pp for psionics, and a ton of other stuff. This doesn't affect me personally at all (except for the settings, which I'm still very sore about). I just think WotC is making bad choices for bad reasons. I like talking about gaming, but almost everybody devotes their attention to WotC so if I want to get into a conversation it's probably going to be about WotC.

Its a shame. I'd love to talk about companies and games I like, but WotC sucks so much air out of the room that most of the activity is about them and their (IMO) substandard game. A lot of people won't even consider looking at, playing, or talking about anything else.

Agreed. If there's any attitude that's deleterious to the 5e community as a whole, it's the idea that WotC stuff is the standard and every other product needs to be looked at with a jaundiced eye because it might not be "balanced" (even though tons of WotC stuff also doesn't meet that standard.)

There are multiple books worth of 3pp material that is straight up better than WotC's stuff.

 

[EzekielRaiden]

Agreed. If there's any attitude that's deleterious to the 5e community as a whole, it's the idea that WotC stuff is the standard and every other product needs to be looked at with a jaundiced eye because it might not be "balanced" (even though tons of WotC stuff also doesn't meet that standard.)

There are multiple books worth of 3pp material that is straight up better than WotC's stuff.

"Balance" is only a bad word when applied to WotC products.

It's an absolute requirement when applied to non-WotC products.

 

[Micah Sweet]

yes, what I personally want them to do.

The idea that whatever the majority of respondents to a popularity poll like is automatically what is best for the game is a false equivalency, and unfortunately such a pervasive one that it's proponents cannot even see another way of looking at things.

 

[Micah Sweet]

"Balance" is only a bad word when applied to WotC products.

It's an absolute requirement when applied to non-WotC products.

Not to me. To me it's a valid but not top concern everywhere.

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

looks like the Kobold statement was not that controversial after all

I disagree. I think that many people (including me) correctly excoriated the statement, but then moved on to other things.

There's not a whole lot to say. They are creating FUD, and AFAIC, I think a lot less of them as a company. The reason the conversation moved on to other things is twofold:

1. Anyone who is paying the slightest bit of attention knows the statement is not provably correct and there is absolutely no real defense of it.

2. There's not much else to say about it- because Kobold Press doesn't have a shipping product. Instead, it's just another conversation about D&D. Which ... I guess in a way makes Micah correct in a small sense in terms of the forum. It is very difficult to keep conversations going that aren't about D&D.

Is Kobold's statement the worst thing ever, compared to, oh, what is going on with Wyrmwood? Of course not. But as we often say here, "Don't tell me why something else sucks. Tell me why your game is good."