LA vs ECL

[PallidPatience]

My biggest contention with ECL/LA/Racial hit dice is that the racial hit dice doesn't combine in any way with the racial abilities. In other words, they're treated as separate things. The way I see it, this would be like saying that a 20th level Wizard is an ECL 40 character, with 20 "Wizard Hit Dice" and 20 levels of effective caster level...

 

[Aus_Snow]

Yeah. Also, not all racial hit dice were created equal. That's a biggie.

 

[ChimericDream]

For those interested, I've got my alternative rules posted in the House Rules section. I decided that since the rules don't support my view of the way things should be (or at least the way they make sense in my head), I should do as all do and make a variant!

Of course, it's only as good as its feedback, so help and advice are certainly appreciated.

 

[Wrathamon]

Yeah. Also, not all racial hit dice were created equal. That's a biggie.

That is my main issue.

2 levels of monstrous humanoid or giant does not = character levels.

try playing a giant rogue... you have no skill pts.


racial HD should just be part of the LA calculation.

 

[saucercrab]

My biggest contention with ECL/LA/Racial hit dice is that the racial hit dice doesn't combine in any way with the racial abilities. In other words, they're treated as separate things. The way I see it, this would be like saying that a 20th level Wizard is an ECL 40 character, with 20 "Wizard Hit Dice" and 20 levels of effective caster level...

I don't see racial HD & racial abilities as separate/not combining. I just treat LA as such a character that has more abilities/bonuses than would be comparable for the HD alone; she has so many benefits for her HD, that she has an LA to compensate for the extras.

 

[Li Shenron]

I've never thought about this before...

I think there should be a way to replace the racial HD with class levels, just like it happens to every 1-HD race!

For example, a MM Satyr (5 HD) can be used as-is, and would be a sort of "Satyr commoner", a generic, class-less specimen of his race. But another Satyr could be a 5th level Rogue, and have 5 HD each one from a level of Rogue.

I don't mean to make this a gradual process, so that a Satyr could start class-less (5 racial HD) and then become a 1st level Rogue, replacing all benefits of his 5th racial HD with the first level of Rogue (or IOW having 4 racial HD + 1 Rogue HD). This may be too difficult, and it doesn't work well for PCs.

But at least there could be an option for games which start at a high level enough, to give up ALL the racial HD in exchange for the same amount of class levels. In a game which starts at level 7, a PC could be a Satyr with 5 class levels that would replace ALL benefits of the 5 racial HD (LA is still counted for its own purposes).

Would this be impossible?


edit: if you think about it, racial HD are always "weaker" than class levels... they grant the basic benefits of class HD (BAB, ST, HP, skills, feats) which could be better/worse depending on the class, but then they grant no other benefits (except increasing DC of special abilities) -> replacing racial HD entirely with class levels may actually simplify the calculation of CR

 

[Legildur]

2 levels of monstrous humanoid or giant does not = character levels.

try playing a giant rogue... you have no skill pts.


racial HD should just be part of the LA calculation.

Possibly your are right, but not all choices are bad.

I'm looking at a bugbear Rranger at the moment (+1 LA, 3HD), so for an ECL7 character, I'm looking at 3 levels of Ranger. Still, the racial HD are d8 with a good Reflex save and 6+Int skill points per HD (with stealth/observation skills as racial skills). But the biggy for a ranger? Bugbears get Scent! Try and evade that tracker!