D&D 5E Legends and Lore July 28: Keeping it Classy

[thunktanker]

For those unhappy with the quantity of sub-classes, I have a feeling that this is not the end of sub-classes - and in fact, this is one area where WotC may go a bit splat-crazy. We're going to sub-classes all over the place, in setting books, supplements, even adventures. They're also probably really easy to house rule, and I imagine the DMG will offer guidelines.



Silk is unforgettable. But I think he could be made with the Thief sub-class, maybe Assassin but I see more Thief.



I could be mistaken, but aren't sub-classes optional? A generalist wizard would be without a sub-class, perhaps?

But then you would give up all the goodies that come with taking a specialty! I think that wizards are rather generalist anyway. Unless the DM makes wizards only pick spells within their specialty, there is nothing stopping a specialist in one school from picking spells in another school. That seems to provide plenty of opportunities to be a generalist to me.

 

[ExploderWizard]

The PHB isn't even out yet and 5E is horribly broken. You can start play as a Great Old One at 1st level!!! No other class stands a chance to compete with that. What were they thinking?

 

[Mercurius]

I don't think they're "optional" so much as each one has a baseline sub-class that is the Basic version. So if you didn't want to choose one, that'd be the one you'd have. So there's no "sub-classless" wizard, it's the Evocation wizard.

Cool, thanks for the clarification.

How wrong it is that I've yet to read the PHB and I'm already thinking about further expansions with more colleges, circles, traditions, etc.?

It is called being a "D&D enthusiast." Or diehard, etc etc.

You're not alone.

 

[Juriel]

I dunno, am I missing something? Eldritch Blast is pretty much always as good or better than hitting something with a sword

You're right, I'd completely missed that Eldritch Blast didn't work like other cantrips, but gave you extra beams. Oh snap, that makes gishing a Warlock so very pointless. Nevermind, only valid build for them is Eldritch Blasting, especially with the hilarity of targeting the same foe with all your beams, with the Invocation that lets you push them backwards with each hit.

 

[Savage Wombat]

The PHB isn't even out yet and 5E is horribly broken. You can start play as a Great Old One at 1st level!!! No other class stands a chance to compete with that. What were they thinking?

Gary Gygax's original campaign let you play a PC Great Old One, as long as you started as a Young one.

/perhaps the one with the stars glued to his forehead?

 

[TerraDave]

I have been holding my excitement for the core books...but now I am starting to feel it.

Between what is there, the backgrounds, and the chunky feats, a lot of character concepts are covered. Not just Champions you can make anything!--not that there is anything wrong with that--but tangible options. Many, many detailed ways to go.

And of course we will get more. I just hope in a controlled, quality oriented manner.

...
I'm more bothered by all Clerics following the same pattern, everyone getting the same spells, and then a few Wizard spells on top of those, nevermind the theme.

2nd edition style spheres where flavorful but very hard to balance in practice. I don't really miss them. I think the subclass gives you a lot of customization without worrying that you have the "wrong" kind of cleric.

 

[Minigiant]

I am shocked that they didn't include either the Thug Fighter or Brute Rogue. Both are iconic in 3e and 4e.

How can I be Batman now. Fighter/rogues never cut it. They never do.

Wanna show the dragon who is the night.

 

[Remathilis]

You cannot be a generalist (non-specialist) wizard?

No, but its not very needed. Specializing gives you some extra powers and a bonus to a certain school, but no limitation on schools available. So invokers can use spells from all eight schools, they just get a bonus to one type of magic that they tend to focus on. (Which is fine by me; most wizards I saw ended up focusing on a few schools anyway but never picked a specialty because they didn't want to give up that one good spell from X school; invisibility, magic missile, dispel magic, etc).

So feylock, fiendlock, &... GOOlock? o_0

Not sure how I can comment on that in a grandma-friendly manner....

Tentaclock? Lovecraftlock? Yeah, I got nothing.

For the Bard, it appears the College of Wit from the playtest has been dropped? Man, vicious mockery was a thing in 4e! The smack-talking social hero seems apropos for bard, with only a bit of overlap with the Rogue's Arcane Trickster.

For the Sorcerer, there are so many options for other lineages! Dragon and Wild Magic are great, but something that is a little more accommodating of different character back stories would be great too. Something like an Elementalist pops out as a common archetype that isn't explicitly covered.

Some of the college of whit made it into the core bard. You might be happy to known you can be viciously mocked when you reach the spell section of the PHB. ;-)

and I agree, the first thing I'm working on when I get the proper PHB is a shadow-bloodline sorcerer!

I really hope that the Eldritch Knight bucks the trend of previous editions attempts and enables the creation of a decent fighter-mage.

On its own, its ok (as others have said). However, you can REALLY get the steam going with it if you either multi-class a few wizard levels OR take the Spell Sniper, Ritual Caster, and Magical Adept feats to expand out his magic ability. If you reside that its more "Basic-era Elf" and less "AD&D style Gish" then it works.

How wrong it is that I've yet to read the PHB and I'm already thinking about further expansions with more colleges, circles, traditions, etc.?

As you should!

The PHB isn't even out yet and 5E is horribly broken. You can start play as a Great Old One at 1st level!!! No other class stands a chance to compete with that. What were they thinking?

Yeah, but you spend most of the game sleeping on a dying star until 20th level...

 

[DMZ2112]

One of Warlock's pacts is "Great Old One". Star pact in 4e is mostly Cthulhu-like being, so I guess this is cosmetic change. Still, I prefer the title "Star pact". I hope it's easy enough to refluf.

Yeah, "Great Old One" is a little on the nose, and I'm sadly tired of Cthulhu. Respect to Chaosium, but what was dark, tongue-in-cheek humor in the '80s has become a mass-market defanging of both the character and the genre. Jackson and Kovalic, I'm looking at you.

The Far Plane still had some tooth.

Ah, Silk, now there's a rogue with a noble background if ever I saw one. Trained in Acrobatics, Deception, Insight and Slight of hand.

Agreed. That's the benefit of backgrounds -- Silk can be a nobleman merchant of questionable ethics without also crippling his abilities in stealth, combat, or larceny. He was a snarky negotiator but he was also a capable cutpurse.

Dangit, now I need to read those books again.

Having reread them recently I'm pleased by how well they hold up.

Tentaclock? Lovecraftlock? Yeah, I got nothing.

Cthulhock.

 

[Remathilis]

I am shocked that they didn't include either the Thug Fighter or Brute Rogue. Both are iconic in 3e and 4e.

How can I be Batman now. Fighter/rogues never cut it. They never do.

Wanna show the dragon who is the night.

Fighter with a decent dex, light/medium armor, a bludgeoning weapon and the criminal background (Deception, Stealth, Thieves Tools, Gaming set) should do it. Hell, add the Tavern Brawler feat and your all set!