Mistwell
Crusty Old Meatwad (he/him)
He does say that, it's just subtle. He says it was a rules change they made. They're supporting both.
Legends & Lore: Experience Points and Levels
He does say that, it's just subtle. He says it was a rules change they made. They're supporting both.
M.L. Martin
Adventurer
That's not necessarily a bad thing. If this is going to reach more than the hardcore gamers, they'll need to provide support for those who come to the game fresh--and support for those who prefer a more open-ended, sandbox or "PvP MMO" style* and those who like a more linear, "console RPG" style will be necessary.
*Seriously, read Old Geezer's writings on what the original game was like. It reads a lot like a persistent-world MMO with strong PvP elements, with the big difference being the asynchronous nature of the multiplayer--hence the emphasis on keeping strict time records.
Alternative, one could call this the 'arcade game' mode--life is cheap, restarts are easy, and high score is the goal. 
Dungeoneer
First Post
Hah, Mike Mearls must lurk around here after all.
I read the article as saying that 5e will support both XP and story-driven leveling. That seems quite sensible. Good job.
GMforPowergamers
Legend
Hah, Mike Mearls must lurk around here after all.
I read the article as saying that 5e will support both XP and story-driven leveling. That seems quite sensible. Good job.
he may not be lurking... there are a lot of people here who could be anyone...
Henrix
Explorer
Indeed. It would be better to give only nominal XP, or none, for blood.
And then some individual goals giving XP and we're getting somewhere.
Li Shenron
Legend
It's definitely a good this to see both methods of level advancement officially acknowledged.
That said, the books need XP values for those using this method, while the XP-less advancement was always automatically supported for those who wanted, me included.
Maybe one day in the future, also the third method will be acknowledged: no level advancement at all. Just pick your sweet spot, and play a campaign there. Narrative doesn't always need level advancement, and not every campaign needs a strictly increasing difficulty (apart from the fact the difficult isn't even automatically increasing, since monsters and PCs tend to "level up" at the same time).
That said, the books need XP values for those using this method, while the XP-less advancement was always automatically supported for those who wanted, me included.
Maybe one day in the future, also the third method will be acknowledged: no level advancement at all. Just pick your sweet spot, and play a campaign there. Narrative doesn't always need level advancement, and not every campaign needs a strictly increasing difficulty (apart from the fact the difficult isn't even automatically increasing, since monsters and PCs tend to "level up" at the same time).
Argyle King
Legend
Sounds good to me.
Not counting individual XP, and just leveling when it seems appropriate is a pretty common practice. It's nothing new for me. However, I do like that it will be presented as an option. I try to remember that not everyone playing D&D is experienced with rpgs or D&D. Sometimes, something which might be obvious to me still needs to be stated for the benefit of others. Likewise, there are very likely things which are obvious to others, but need to be stated for me.
Not counting individual XP, and just leveling when it seems appropriate is a pretty common practice. It's nothing new for me. However, I do like that it will be presented as an option. I try to remember that not everyone playing D&D is experienced with rpgs or D&D. Sometimes, something which might be obvious to me still needs to be stated for the benefit of others. Likewise, there are very likely things which are obvious to others, but need to be stated for me.
Plaguescarred
D&D Playtester for WoTC since 2012
Works for me. You can also have both using XP, simply give quest XP for ending important chapter of an adventure path.
Mistwell
Crusty Old Meatwad (he/him)
Perhaps worth noting that in the recent Scourge of the Sword Coast adventure, the monsters in the bestiary list no XP, and the adventure simply states when the party levels as follows:
GAINING EXPERIENCE
Characters start the adventure at 2nd level. They then gain levels as follows.
3rd Level: When the party returns from [LOCATION], the characters advance to 3rd level.
4th Level: When the party returns from [LOCATION], the characters advance to 4th level.
5th Level: After the party deals with the [FOE] during the adventure’s conclusion, the characters
advance to 5th level.
I found the lack of XP listings in the bestiary a bit of a nuisance, since I am trying to insert some of these creatures in my own adventure and I would like to know their level and XP value.
GAINING EXPERIENCE
Characters start the adventure at 2nd level. They then gain levels as follows.
3rd Level: When the party returns from [LOCATION], the characters advance to 3rd level.
4th Level: When the party returns from [LOCATION], the characters advance to 4th level.
5th Level: After the party deals with the [FOE] during the adventure’s conclusion, the characters
advance to 5th level.
I found the lack of XP listings in the bestiary a bit of a nuisance, since I am trying to insert some of these creatures in my own adventure and I would like to know their level and XP value.
I'm actually very taken with the idea of using Goals as the measuring stick for XP / level advancement in story-driven campaigns rather than XPs-per-kill or flat "Get here, gain a level" markers.
Tabulate successes and failures as it relates to Goals to achieve campaign victories and what 13th Age called "Campaign Loses."
I could see an adventure path where X Campaign Victories bring you up a level, while Campaign Losses give the DM license to let the consequences stir up a little more havoc. I kind of like the idea of racing against "Campaign Losses," maybe even having to go out of your way and score extra victories or otherwise mitigate those campaign losses before moving onto the next stage in the path.
- Marty Lund
Tabulate successes and failures as it relates to Goals to achieve campaign victories and what 13th Age called "Campaign Loses."
I could see an adventure path where X Campaign Victories bring you up a level, while Campaign Losses give the DM license to let the consequences stir up a little more havoc. I kind of like the idea of racing against "Campaign Losses," maybe even having to go out of your way and score extra victories or otherwise mitigate those campaign losses before moving onto the next stage in the path.
- Marty Lund
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