Lesser Vigor (2 Yes votes as modified)

[Ferrix]

You forget, then. I'm trying to nerf the spell's effects at low levels because I think the balance is wrong. I would be okay with 6 + 1 round per level max 15 also. That's a significant advantage in healing, particularly at higher levels (The sweet spot is probably closer to 6.5, but that isn't possible with a flat-rate).

I think it should at the very least heal 8 points before adding levels, basically like a maximized cure light spell but spread out at 1 point per round which is a significant disadvantage.

It is also at a significant disadvantage to cure spells in the fact that clerics can often time spontaneously cast them and don't need to memorize them.

Is a 1st level spell that deals 1 point of damage for 10 rounds + 1 round per level with a maximum of 15 rounds unbalanced? If your combat takes 15 rounds at that level, you are probably already dead.

 

[Bront]

Personaly, I realy don't have a huge problem with Lessor Vigor, particularly because A - As stated in other sources, non-core spells aren't simply available to everyone. Also, it's not spontanious for clerics.

I just wanted to settle the extend issue. I personaly don't think it's a big problem, and I'm willing to let it be extended, but I'll bow to popular demand.

I do disagree with Patlin though on how empower works, because with his interpretation, fireball can't go over 10d6, and that's the staple example.

 

[Patlin]

I do disagree with Patlin though on how empower works, because with his interpretation, fireball can't go over 10d6, and that's the staple example.

I'm certainly not saying empower doesn't work with fireball, but I don't want to beat a dead horse here...

 

[Bront]

I'm certainly not saying empower doesn't work with fireball, but I don't want to beat a dead horse here...

This is what discussion it about. I just disagree with how you read the feat on one power, because it should be consistant on all powers, and that interpretation in my opinion means it isn't. However, I'm actualy quite glad you've been willing to offer your opinion and state it openly, and I do respect your opinion, even if I have managed to agree with it the past few times we've talked about game material. It's good to hear both sides.

 

[Ferrix]

This is what discussion it about. I just disagree with how you read the feat on one power, because it should be consistant on all powers, and that interpretation in my opinion means it isn't. However, I'm actualy quite glad you've been willing to offer your opinion and state it openly, and I do respect your opinion, even if I have managed to agree with it the past few times we've talked about game material. It's good to hear both sides.

I second Bront's positive attitude!

 

[Patlin]

I second Bront's positive attitude!

 

[Patlin]

As I see it, we then have two issues needing a vote.

1) Shall we allow the Lesser Vigor spell?
2) Shall an extended lesser vigor have a 15 round cap? (The alternative being a 30 round cap.)

 

[Ferrix]

As I see it, we then have two issues needing a vote.

1) Shall we allow the Lesser Vigor spell?
2) Shall an extended lesser vigor have a 15 round cap? (The alternative being a 30 round cap.)

1) Yes
2) Still under discussion.

 

[Rystil Arden]

1) NO

2) Under discussion--it would be more balanced, but I think it isn't what is meant to happen.

By the way, I messed up my math the second time around when I said 6--it should be 7, not 6, like the average of 2d6, as I proposed initially. I'd want it to give an amount equal to an empowered CLW, balanced by the longer duration (which since characters immediately rouse every time they go above 0 doesn't mean a lot, especially since it's going to be used out of battle)

 

[Velmont]

I'd want it to give an amount equal to an empowered CLW, balanced by the longer duration (which since characters immediately rouse every time they go above 0 doesn't mean a lot, especially since it's going to be used out of battle)

Vigor: Heal 10 + 1 hp/level (Max:15 at level 5, Average at level 5: 15)
Empowered CLW: Heal Between 1 and 12 + 1 hp/level (Max:17 at level 5, Average at level 5: 11.5)

Vigor better than an empower CLW in term of healing. If you want him to be equivalent, I would suggest to simply reduce the duration to 7 + 1 / level, maximum 12 (at level 5).

And if you put it in a wand, it means that the wand will heal 400 hp instead of 275. For a med or high level party, it is just better, as they will never use such wand in combat, but for low level, it depend on teh use you want of such wand.