D&D 5E Levels of literary heroes (and inflation thereof)

[n00b f00]

Xena is like lvl 10 dex fighter. Right? I haven't seen a lot of episodes since the show was airing. But she killed a decent number of monsters, and killed mooks in the hanful. Sometimes killing 4 in a single round (action surge). There was that one episode she killed like a 100 dudes and almost died. This is not counting all the times she got powered up on the semi reg.

How would you stat a character from a mostly mundane setting like Game of Thrones? How credibly they defeat professional mooks and chreography /description ?

 

[delericho]

Also, Luke seems higher than level 1 even at the start of the first movie.

He doesn't need to be level 1 - the game could certainly start PCs at level 3 (or whatever). But Luke Skywalker, at the start of his adventuring career, really should be a valid starting character in a Star Wars RPG.

I was more flummoxed by SWSE making Han Solo and Chewbacca mental giants. No they're not.

Agreed. One of the things that most annoyed me about the EU was the absurd reverence given to the 'named' characters, and Han Solo in particular. And one of the things that most pleased me about TFA was that it didn't do that.

 

[S'mon]

I was just talking about this on Saturday re WEG d6 Star Wars:

"It's a great game - (unlike SWd20) your PC feels like a Star Wars movie character right away... Unfortunately the *actual* movie characters get statted 4 times as powerful!"

Likewise I was just reading old Dragon 'Giants in the Earth', a lot of the stats for literary characters are utterly ludicrous and bear no resemblance to their in-book depictions. H Ridder Hagard's immortal 'She' might make a good Clr-9 High Priestess in a low-magic world... she gets statted at something like 30th level!

John Carter, the classic Fighting Man 'Superhero', should be Ftr-8, not 24th or whatever.

 

[S'mon]

He doesn't need to be level 1 - the game could certainly start PCs at level 3 (or whatever). But Luke Skywalker, at the start of his adventuring career, really should be a valid starting character in a Star Wars RPG.

A WEG d6 Star Wars Brash Pilot PC emulates Luke Skywalker perfectly IMO. They did a great job emulating the movie feel, IF you ignore the official NPC stats.

 

[delericho]

A WEG d6 Star Wars Brash Pilot PC emulates Luke Skywalker perfectly IMO. They did a great job emulating the movie feel, IF you ignore the official NPC stats.

Agreed. Though I forget how Force Sensitivity works in d6 SW - am I right in thinking it's just something you choose, or do you need to spend build points to get it?

 

[CapnZapp]

Not having read the entire thread, let me just say that I love how level inflation has been reduced massively for 5th Edition.

In 3E, every other guild leader, town mage, bandit chieftain or just passing adventurer were level 10-15.

In 5E, even the king of a great city can be allowed to be "only" a "veteran" or "knight", with an effective CR of perhaps half that!

 

[jayoungr]

Personally, I would put Aragorn as an Ancient Paladin with a background that got him those wilderness skills. We don't need a Ranger chasis for the wilderness skills, and the holy sword, "hands are a healer" bits reflect the paladin more than they do the Ranger.

I would say the sword and healing hands come from a custom background--"lost heir," perhaps. It grants amazing but extremely situational benefits. And actually, the sword is more of a symbol than anything else; I don't recall it doing anything that any other sword couldn't, so it probably doesn't grant any mechanical benefits. So it's really just the healing.

But that aside... the sheer scope of healings that Aragorn performed is a pretty big hint that he's not just a low level character.

Not sure I agree there. His most impressive healing jobs are all related to the Black Breath, which is part of that background. It's not the sort of thing just any character could learn to do given a high enough level; you have to come from the right family.

 

[Mephista]

And actually, the sword is more of a symbol than anything else; I don't recall it doing anything that any other sword couldn't, so it probably doesn't grant any mechanical benefits.

The sword had more detail in the Silmarillion. It was supposed to be one of the strongest blades ever made in the Middle-Earth, the equivalent of an Excalibur in our legends.

Not sure I agree there. His most impressive healing jobs are all related to the Black Breath, which is part of that background.

He spent hours healing after the seige of Gondor. You've got to notice the full extent throughout the entire matieral, not just one situation.

It's not the sort of thing just any character could learn to do given a high enough level; you have to come from the right family.

If your solution is "create custom content that's OP for its level," then we might as well not try to convert any character.

 

[jayoungr]

The sword had more detail in the Silmarillion. It was supposed to be one of the strongest blades ever made in the Middle-Earth, the equivalent of an Excalibur in our legends.

I've read the Silmarillion. But does the sword give him a better chance to hit or do more damage? That's what is reflected mechanically in the game. Otherwise it's just (awesome) flavor text. Maybe a special ability to help it resist breaking, but weapon breakage isn't really a thing in-game. Or perhaps you could argue that the toughness gives it some kind of armor piercing ability. But there's no sign that it's any more powerful than the regular stuff in the DMG.

He spent hours healing after the seige of Gondor. You've got to notice the full extent throughout the entire matieral, not just one situation.

I take that into account, but most if not all the healing he did at that time would have been curing the Black Breath. Which no non-royal healer can do, no matter how skilled. So it isn't a matter of level.

If your solution is "create custom content that's OP for its level," then we might as well not try to convert any character.

I was being somewhat tongue-in-cheek by calling it a custom background, but really, I don't think most canon Tolkien characters can be statted accurately in D&D. This is largely because it's extremely hard to pin down exactly what their abilities are. Tolkien tends to give you just enough information to spark your imagination, and you don't discover until you discuss it with another fan that other people have an entirely different picture of what certain statements mean.

 

[AverageCitizen]

One of the things that most annoyed me about the EU was the absurd reverence given to the 'named' characters, and Han Solo in particular. And one of the things that most pleased me about TFA was that it didn't do that.

Bringing this back to Sacrosanct's point, I think you hit on something. Both the EU and RPG authors have too much fanboy in them and tend to overstat the main characters. In SWSEs defense, it was both cannon and EU inclusive, so if it said somewhere that Chewie was a tactical genius or the best mechanic in the galaxy, that would show up in SE. (Personally I suspect that neither of them were really gifted mechanically, at least not at first).