Licensing, OGL and Getting D&D Compatible Publishers Involved

I think you underestimate the fickleness of us gamers. If we're one thing, we're fickle. Our ability to transfer allegiance en masse overnight is legendary. Our ability to not see that about ourselves is equally legendary.

Is this actually the case? Of people who post on boards, perhaps. But generally? I'm not so sure. And even here, the very fact that we're debating this, and maintaining hope for 5e, is that we're not fickle. There's something about "D&D" that isn't being met by other games, and that we want in our play or in our imaginations.

The OGL was a magnificent tool for building and perpetuating a player base that recognized the realities of the internet. By abandoning it, WOTC demonstrated that they misunderstood what it was they controlled (and the existence and success of Pathfinder demonstrates that). [I won't draw the inverse conclusion, that its absence from 4e was a primary component in its reduced success, though I expect that's valid too.] The OGL could even be appropriated for other non-d20 systems (cf. pre-Core FATE games). But in the end, it's just a tool (for marketing, product development, and online interface).

Perhaps gamers will transfer allegiance legendarily for one thing or another, but that doesn't stop loyalty to a particular game idea -- and among fantasy RPGs, the gold standard has always been D&D.
 

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Concerning legal advice : IANAL, but people could consider first publishing in non Anglo Saxon countries. For instance, french droit d'auteur...

IMO it was wise to first publish OSRIC in the UK not USA, but I wouldn't particularly
advise first publishing in Civil Law nations; their legal systems don't give nearly as much weight to contracts, and the OGL is a contract. They're much more concerned with fairness and
good faith, which could include eg "this is what WoTC intended" as opposed to "this is what
WotC actually did". English law both upholds contracts and tends to interpret ambiguous terms in standard form contracts against the party who wrote the standard term, ie WoTC for the
OGL. English law also generally does not have punitive damages, and loser usually pays
winner's costs, making vexatious litigation unwise.
 

On the subject of licensing, a limited third-party product license has been floated for Numenera, here.

IANAL, but the guy who wrote this is:

As many of you know, I am a lawyer and a game publisher. I frequently help out gamers and game publishers with legal issues, including dealing with licenses. So, I had more than a few people ask me my thoughts about the #Numenera license from +Monte Cook 's Games. I've seen it get some conversation elsewhere. +Rob Donoghue has a thoughtful post on the matter over on the +Evil Hat Productions blog (http://walkingmind.evilhat.com/2013/10/08/numenera-licensing/), and there's a robust discussion of it on the Ninth World fansite (http://theninthworld.com/thoughts-numenera-licensing/). I posted some brief comments on twitter last night and quickly realized that I needed to expand on that a bit as they could easily be taken in the wrong light. So, here goes:

For starters, I'm only addressing the legal issues. I have no issue with the license as a matter of policy. I think it is well crafted to accomplish what Monte is looking to do, i.e., foster a healthy fan-based community. I understand the basis the various elements of the license, e.g., the $50 fee, the sales cap, the crowdfunding restriction, etc. I should also mention that I have the utmost respect for Monte both as a publisher/designer and, more generally, as a person. Some of my earliest publishing work was playing in Monte's sandbox. Indeed, my very first publication, Poisoncraft, included conversion notes for Monte's then-Arcana Unearthed (which, by the way, had its own, similar license).

That said, I just don't think the license is particularly well written as a legal document. Here are some of my concerns with it as a legal document:

First, without getting too knee-deep into legalese, the license is a self-contained legal document, a contract. Statements made outside the four corners of that document would generally not be admissible to interpret or modify it under the parol evidence rule. So, explanations about what something in the contract means presented on a forum, in an e-mail, or an twitter are not helpful.

Relatedly, there are some ambiguities in the license:

a) What constitutes a "sale" for purposes of the $2,000 cap? MCG has clarified in a couple of places that they mean it to be on the net sales, but see #1 above. Even that doesn't solve the issue. If I can deduct the vendor's cut, can I also deduct, say, royalties paid to writers or illustrator?

b) What happens when I hit the $2,000-sale ceiling. I'm highly unlikely to hit that number on the nose. Let's say I notice when I get to $2,073.82. As a technical matter, I've violated the license.

c) What if I'm selling in a foreign country? Do sales in francs not count? Do I need to convert to US dollars?

d) The crowdfunding ban doesn't apply until the license is accepted. What happens if I've crowdfunded a setting and offered to do a Numenera version as a stretch goal prior to executing the license? Also, "crowdfunding" is itself fairly vague. I assume they mean crowdfunding sites like Kickstarter, but the language would seem to preclude even private crowdfunding.

e) It authorizes MCG to terminate the license at will without cause. As a technical matter, if I am producing a pdf, they could terminate my license before I even start selling it. I certainly wouldn't expect them to do that. But the bigger problem is that it might constitute an illusory promise, which makes the contract void generally.

f) It does not have a choice of law provision. That makes it unclear which state's law would apply in any court case between parties of different jurisdictions. Now, what if I'm in a different country altogether?

g) It requires you to send them 3 copies of the work. Even if it's a pdf. Silly, I know, but I point it out only as an indication that the license wasn't particularly well crafted.

h) It uses "thereof". Man, I hate that word.

I'm not highlighting these issues to be mean-spirited. I'm not trying to offend Monte or whoever wrote the license. As I intimated on twitter, I'm frankly not sure they care all that much about its utility as a legal document. It might be more of an exercise in nudge theory, discouraging the lowest form of third-party material and ignoring minor technicalities from legitimate producers.

I do think it's important to discuss this sort of thing in public for educational reasons, so people will have an idea of some issues they might not otherwise consider. A license is a legal document. I wouldn't ask a game designer to craft a license any more than I would ask a lawyer to design my game. (Present company excluded of course.)
 


Why is this in a 5e thread?

Seriously? It's a thread explicitly about the possibilities for the OGL or a related license for 5e. Here is the latest word on exactly that for a similar and competing product. If you are not interested, simply ignore.
 

Seriously? It's a thread explicitly about the possibilities for the OGL or a related license for 5e. Here is the latest word on exactly that for a similar and competing product. If you are not interested, simply ignore.

It's not a competing product, it's not similar, and it's not OGL related. Numenera is excluded from this forum. Morrus already started this same topic over in the forum that's for Numenera discussion. Go here to discuss the Numenera license: http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?345782-Numenera-s-Limited-License.
 
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It's not a competing product, it's not similar, and it's not OGL related. Numenera is excluded from this forum. Morrus already started this same topic over in the forum that's for Numenera discussion. Go here to discuss the Numenera license: http://www.enworld.org/forum/showthread.php?345782-Numenera-s-Limited-License.
Since we don't know that a 5e license, if one even ever exists, will use the OGL at all (and I suspect it won't), looking at contemporary legal licenses issued by people in the RPG industry, particularly those who are intimately familiar with the OGL, d20 license, and GSL, is IMO perfectly valid in this thread. It's an insight into the concerns Monte Cook has about the OGL, and how he is dealing with them.
If you want to look at nothing but the OGL...well, it's a short conversation.
 

Since we don't know that a 5e license, if one even ever exists, will use the OGL at all (and I suspect it won't), looking at contemporary legal licenses issued by people in the RPG industry, particularly those who are intimately familiar with the OGL, d20 license, and GSL, is IMO perfectly valid in this thread. It's an insight into the concerns Monte Cook has about the OGL, and how he is dealing with them.
If you want to look at nothing but the OGL...well, it's a short conversation.

It was a detailed point by point critique of that particular wording of that particular license by an attorney from a blog. It really REALLY had no baring on this discussing. How you phrase a particular sentence (when Monte didn't use an attorney to draft the initial one, and the initial one was just a test by him anyway) is not relevant to this discussion. If you want to get into that level of detail about that license, go to the thread about the license in the appropriate forum.

You'll note it didn't aid any discussion here. Nobody is looking at that blog post and saying "Wow great point, the choice of law provision from Monte's tentative non-finalized quasi-license from his non-D&D non-OGL game doesn't have a choice of law clause, that means D&D Next will....?"
 

You'll note it didn't aid any discussion here. Nobody is looking at that blog post and saying "Wow great point, the choice of law provision from Monte's tentative non-finalized quasi-license from his non-D&D non-OGL game doesn't have a choice of law clause, that means D&D Next will....?"

I found the post useful and more relevant to the topic of the thread than your "thread police" posts, which certainly aren't a great boon to discussion. So, who's the pot and who's the kettle? Morrus reads this thread; if he thinks it's off-topic, he'll deal with it. Or click on the report post button.
 


Arguing about whether or not it is relevant doesn't exactly advance the thread, guys.

Official ruling:

1) It is relevant, as an example of another license. If you're going to sit around speculating, some examples of what exists and can be done are relevant. Not that WotC is listening to *your* speculations, as they have a legal team and all that which trump any messageboard duffer about tenfold...

2) It is irrelevant, insofar as line-by-line dissection of legal language is useful to real lawyers, and perhaps actual publishers, but useless to the rest of the world, however hip the author is trying to make it sound.

Thus - discussing the general structure of Numenera's license as an example of possibilities is fine. But discuss the spirit of the license, please, and leave the letter of the law to the professionals.

Thanks, all!
 

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