D&D 5E magic items prices

[Werebat]

Basically, the whole system is set up to where you don't sell magic items and you are penalized if you try.

This may be in reaction to 3E (IDK what 4E did), where players were penalized for NOT selling off 90% of items and using the money they got to craft more efficient items.

All while bitching that they never found anything "cool", all their gear had been crafted or purchased, etc.

Players will just have to find another way to min/max munchkin that doesn't involve cheese combos with magic items. Remember, your DM can read the same optimization forums that you can. Armor made of nightsticks to fuel your divine metamagic? WHAT nightsticks? Heh.

 

[Nergal Pendragon]

This may be in reaction to 3E (IDK what 4E did), where players were penalized for NOT selling off 90% of items and using the money they got to craft more efficient items.

All while bitching that they never found anything "cool", all their gear had been crafted or purchased, etc.

Players will just have to find another way to min/max munchkin that doesn't involve cheese combos with magic items. Remember, your DM can read the same optimization forums that you can. Armor made of nightsticks to fuel your divine metamagic? WHAT nightsticks? Heh.

It may be. Which is part of why I always added descriptions to the stuff they found and gave them backstories. Bracers of natural armor? Boring. Magical Bracers of the Last Druid Knight of the Emerald Knight Guild? Players start asking questions, start looking up lore, start being a lot more reluctant to part with them.

Oh, and I loved it when they did those tricks. Sure, you can wear that nightstick armor! Oh, hey, you set a new divine caster fashion trend! For some strange reason, most players don't use optimization exploits when I'm DMing.

 

[Derren]

P.S. RE: "a fool not to buy magic items". A sword +1 is maybe 20% more effective than a regular sword, for ten times the price or more. Even in real-world areas where violence is rife and you are​ a fool not to buy weaponry, how many thugs do you see buying cutting-edge Israeli/American/etc. weaponry instead of a whole pile of cheap-but-effective AK-47s?

The ones outfitting an army buy AK-47s. The ones who buy the weapon for themselves take the newest HK with all extras they can afford and are available.

 

[Werebat]

It may be. Which is part of why I always added descriptions to the stuff they found and gave them backstories. Bracers of natural armor? Boring. Magical Bracers of the Last Druid Knight of the Emerald Knight Guild? Players start asking questions, start looking up lore, start being a lot more reluctant to part with them.

Oh, and I loved it when they did those tricks. Sure, you can wear that nightstick armor! Oh, hey, you set a new divine caster fashion trend! For some strange reason, most players don't use optimization exploits when I'm DMing.

You ALWAYS added those descriptions? To EVERY +1 Amulet of Natural Armor and +1 Cloak of Resistance that every villainous mook in your campaign wore? I don't believe that.

A DM can get away with copycatting the optimized PC schtick maybe once. After that the players (perhaps rightly) cry foul. Either way, it gets boring.

 

[ExploderWizard]

How is the following helpful.

List of Rare items, disposable items are listed as having 2 of them because the book suggests that they are half the value of a permanent item.

• (2x) Arrow +2
• Amulet of Health (sets Con to 19, helpful to almost everyone)
• Leather armor +1 (this is a joke item right? it is the same as normal studded leather which costs 45gp)
• Belt of Hill Giant Strength (why is this the same as a 19 Con item?)
• Cloak of Displacement (one of the most beneficial items in the game IMO)
• Flame Tongue (nice sword good item)
• Glamoured Studded Leather (so 2 points better AC than Leather +1, and can change it's appearance)
• Helm of Teleportation (nice, this changes the whole campaign)
• Portable hole (a classic)
• (2x) Potion of Frost Giant Strength (ie a 23 str, that belt that gives a constant 21 is looking nice)
• Rod of the Pact Keeper +2 (amazing item better than a +2 weapon hands down)
• (2x) Scrolls of Protection

That is just a sample of all rare rated items, the spread of abilities and usefulness is all over the place. Some of those items are way better than others. Some are better than Very Rare items, like the Belt of Giant Strength gives a 21, when the very rare ion stone gives a +2 with a max of 20.

So setting your price based solely on rarity if you want magic item shops is obviously not a good idea.

RARE ITEMS.

Otherwise known as not very likely to be found, and/or perhaps a limited number of them in the world. The concept that is failing to take hold here is that these are MAGICAL items (rare and wonderful). They are not simply workaday "gear" for the common adventurer of level X. Why is a rare work of art worth so much? Oh yeah because its RARE!

If some DM decides that these rare magical items are actually just gear then he or she can price them however. Pricing based on meta-game utility IS saying that this is just gear.

 

[Nergal Pendragon]

You ALWAYS added those descriptions? To EVERY +1 Amulet of Natural Armor and +1 Cloak of Resistance that every villainous mook in your campaign wore? I don't believe that.

A DM can get away with copycatting the optimized PC schtick maybe once. After that the players (perhaps rightly) cry foul. Either way, it gets boring.

When it came to stuff they didn't buy? Yes, I always added it. When it came to mook stuff, I tended to implicate it had been bought, such as them finding a symbol of a magic shop they frequented, or something else (such as "This armor belongs to Bob, enchanted by Stella"-type inscriptions) that gave it a kind of backstory. You would be surprised how quickly you can generate backstories for items just by giving them a name, some unusual description or sigil, and then making things up on the spot when the players ask questions.

It also sometimes led to unusual player actions. Such as the fifth time they ran across a magic staff that had been made by the same wizard. They went completely off the rails, tracked the guy down, and effectively bribed him for a list of magic items he had sold to the people they were fighting. This went badly for the BBEG, since the wizard had made every item the BBEG owned.

 

[MoutonRustique]

RARE ITEMS.

Otherwise known as not very likely to be found, and/or perhaps a limited number of them in the world. The concept that is failing to take hold here is that these are MAGICAL items (rare and wonderful).

The concept that is failing to take hold here is that these are rules meant to help the DM run the game.

They don't.

Or, to put it in the strictest sens : some people (myself included) find them to offer a poor system that is of little use. One that requires more effort to make agreeable than they (the conceptual "they", although, in this case, also the "me" "they") are willing to provide. They (see reference cues above) find this a disagreeable situation and they (idem about the references) are trying to figure out a better alternative through debate.

They are not simply workaday "gear" for the common adventurer of level X. Why is a rare work of art worth so much? Oh yeah because its RARE!

If some DM decides that these rare magical items are actually just gear then he or she can price them however. Pricing based on meta-game utility IS saying that this is just gear.

Reply to bolded part.

Pricing things on meta-game utility is the antithesis to saying that it is just gear - and is NOT the goal. That is the current situation. They are currently priced based upon considerations which have little-to-no in-game rational. You can't get more meta-game than that. Pricing things based on in-game utility, rarity, availability and all the other in-game factors that can affect price IS equating them to... well, all the other things in the world that can be bought and/or sold (which, in many instances, is pretty much everything...) But this is NOT the goal of having well priced magic items! The goal is to have a reliable power gage that helps DMs with a quick referrer as to the amplitude of the impact X or Y could have on his game. That impact often relates pretty well with worth is simply an intuitive assumption that makes in-game pricing easier to rational for many.

I am picking on your word choice in the assumption that this was your exact and desired meaning - if you meant something else, or it was simply a quick "you know what I mean" choice of words, or some other situation, then I am sorry for the "grammar natzi-ing".

 

[Warmaster Horus]

P.S. RE: "a fool not to buy magic items". A sword +1 is maybe 20% more effective than a regular sword, for ten times the price or more. Even in real-world areas where violence is rife and you are​ a fool not to buy weaponry, how many thugs do you see buying cutting-edge Israeli/American/etc. weaponry instead of a whole pile of cheap-but-effective AK-47s?

Get both!

 

[jhingelshod]

It makes sense if you consider the system is designed with the idea players don't sell magic items in the first place and that the optional selling rules in the DMG essentially penalize players by giving them what amount to paltry sums for a lot of the magic items they are likely to be trying to get rid of.

Basically, the whole system is set up to where you don't sell magic items and you are penalized if you try. But, if you check my more recent posts about Eberron, you can see I am also having a problem with this set-up.

That's just it. It is set up to discourage players from selling items and as such it just seems too gamey. It did in 1E and it does now. Of course it's a fantasy game, but in most fantasy worlds economics is, broadly speaking, set up to work in a similar manner to the real world. If you want to sell quick, you take a hit, but what about those players who take the time to find the right buyer....a baron of a neighbouring area say....who is prepared to pay well for that sword?

 

[jhingelshod]

It's only your hyperbole that makes this make no sense. Dealers always sell cars for more than they paid for them -- otherwise they'd go out of business. Most people who sell a car to a dealer are probably aware that the dealer will turn around and sell it for more than they paid for it. What's the typical markup on a used car? I have no idea, and I'll bet neither to most people.

That's the point I was making. It wasn't MY "hyperbole". I was responding to another post that suggested a 100:1 (10,000%) markup "or even higher". I understand that car dealers make a profit and unlike you I actually have a fair idea what it is....about 30-50% give or take. It doesn't seem realistic or believable that anyone in a fantasy or medieval economy would willingly part with a treasured item for 1/100th of it's market value.