D&D 5E Mass Combat

[bleezy]

Here's a way to resolve mass combat that keeps combat simple and uses existing combat rules (for the most part) so that players of all classes can use their regular abilities to turn to the tide of a massive battle. This should also prevent the feeling that the DM is simply deciding the outcome of the battle which may seem very unfair to the PCs, especially if their army is at stake.

Depending of the size of the PCs' army, they may have more than one horde at their command. If the PCs stick together, they can only command one horde. If they split up each player could command his own horde. Naturally, giants, dragons, enemy commanders and spellcasters and similar creatures should all be represented individually with their normal game stats.

Fear and morale effects could simply do psychic damage to a horde at the DM's discretion, causing it to rout at 0 hp.

These hordes are from my own campaign and so berserkers are 3HD warriors, not the NPCs from the MM.

Horde of Berserkers
Gargantuan horde of medium humanoids (human), chaotic neutral
Armor Class 13 (hide armor)
Hit Points 287 (25d20+25)
Speed 30 ft.
STR 14 (+2) DEX 12 (+1) CON 13 (+1) INT 10 (+0) WIS 10 (+0) CHA 12 (+1)
Saving Throws Str +6, Con +5, Cha +5
Condition Immunities grappled, prone, restrained
Senses passive Perception 10
Languages Norse
Challenge 10 (5,900 XP)

Horde. The horde can’t regain hit points or gain temporary hit points. The horde takes a maximum of 15 points of damage from any source that effects only a single target.
When reduced to 0 hit points, the horde disperses; some berserkers are slain, others are wounded or routing. At the DM’s discretion, 2d4 hostile unwounded berserkers may take the place of the horde after it is defeated.
Other than taking damage, the horde is immune to any effect or spell that does not affect an area of at least 20 by 20 ft., or that affects only a finite number of creatures within an area. DM’s discretion and common sense is required here.
A medium or smaller creature can be attacked only once per turn by a horde. A large creature can be attacked twice. A huge or gargantuan creature can be attacked up to three times.
Reckless. At the start of its turn, the horde can gain advantage on all melee weapon attack rolls during that turn, but attack rolls against it have advantage until the start of its next turn.

Multiattack. The horde makes three melee attacks, or two melee attacks if the horde has half of its hit points or fewer.
Swords, spears and axes. Melee Weapon Attack: +10 to hit, reach 5 ft., one target. Hit: 18 (3d10+2) slashing damage.

Horde of Archers
Gargantuan horde of medium humanoids (human), chaotic neutral
Armor Class 12 (leather armor)
Hit Points 210 (20d20)
Speed 30 ft.
STR 11 (+0) DEX 13 (+1) CON 11 (+0) INT 10 (+0) WIS 10 (+0) CHA 12 (+1)
Saving Throws Str +4, Con +4, Cha +5
Condition Immunities grappled, prone, restrained
Senses passive Perception 10
Languages Norse
Challenge 10 (5,900 XP)

Horde. The horde can’t regain hit points or gain temporary hit points. The horde takes a maximum of 10 points of damage from any source that effects only a single target.
When reduced to 0 hit points, the horde disperses; some archers are slain, others are wounded or routing. At the DM’s discretion, 2d4 unwounded archers may take the place of the horde after it is defeated.
Other than taking damage, the horde is immune to any effect or spell that does not affect an area of at least 20 by 20 ft., or that affects only a finite number of creatures within an area. DM’s discretion and common sense is required here.
A medium or smaller creature can be attacked only once per turn by a horde. A large creature can be attacked twice. A huge or gargantuan creature can be attacked up to three times.

Multiattack. The horde makes two attacks, or one attack if the horde has half of its hit points or fewer.
Slings and arrows. Ranged Weapon Attack: +10 to hit, reach 5 ft., one target. Hit: 17 (3d10+1) piercing damage.
Swords and daggers. Melee Weapon Attack: +10 to hit, range 150/600 ft., one target. Hit: 11 (3d6+1) slashing damage.
Rain of Arrows (Recharge 5-6). The horde unleashes a terrible volley of arrows at a point within 400 ft. of it. Each creature within 40 ft. of that point must make a DC 13 Dexterity saving throw, taking 36 (8d8) piercing damage on a failed save, or half as much damage on a successful one.

Horde of Cavalry
Gargantuan horde of medium humanoids (human), chaotic neutral
Armor Class 13 (hide armor)
Hit Points 345 (30d20+30)
Speed 60 ft.
STR 13 (+1) DEX 12 (+1) CON 13 (+1) INT 10 (+0) WIS 10 (+0) CHA 12 (+1)
Saving Throws Str +5, Con +5, Cha +5
Condition Immunities grappled, prone, restrained
Senses passive Perception 10
Languages Norse
Challenge 10 (5,900 XP)

Horde. The horde can’t regain hit points or gain temporary hit points. The horde takes a maximum of 20 points of damage from any source that effects only a single target.
When reduced to 0 hit points, the horde disperses; some cavalry are slain, others are wounded or routing. At the DM’s discretion, 2d4 unwounded cavalry may take the place of the horde after it is defeated.
Other than taking damage, the horde is immune to any effect or spell that does not affect an area of at least 20 by 20 ft., or that affects only a finite number of creatures within an area. DM’s discretion and common sense is required here.
A medium or smaller creature can be attacked only once per turn by a horde. A large creature can be attacked twice. A huge or gargantuan creature can be attacked up to three times.
Trampling Charge. If the horde moves at least 20 feet straight toward a creature and then hits it with a swords, spears and axes attack on the same turn, that target must succeed on a DC 18 Strength saving throw or be knocked prone. If the target is prone, the horde can make one hooves attack against it as a bonus action.

Multiattack. The horde makes three melee attacks, or two melee attacks if the horde has half of its hit points or fewer.
Swords, spears and axes. Melee Weapon Attack: +10 to hit, reach 5 ft., one target. Hit: 23 (4d10+1) slashing damage.
Hooves. Melee Weapon Attack: +10 to hit, reach 5 ft., one target. Hit: 18 (5d6+1) bludgeoning damage.

 

[Tormyr]

Looks like an interesting blend of regular characters and the swarm rules.

Did you ever see the Legends and Lore article on mass combat?
http://archive.wizards.com/DnD/Article.aspx?x=dnd/4ll/20140428
I imagine something close to this will be in the DMG.

 

[mips42]

Horde of Archers
Gargantuan horde of medium humanoids (human), chaotic neutral
Armor Class 12 (leather armor)
Hit Points 210 (20d20)
Speed 30 ft.
STR 11 (+0) DEX 13 (+1) CON 11 (+0) INT 10 (+0) WIS 10 (+0) CHA 12 (+1)
Saving Throws Str +4, Con +4, Cha +5
Condition Immunities grappled, prone, restrained
Senses passive Perception 10
Languages Norse
Challenge 10 (5,900 XP)

Horde. The horde can’t regain hit points or gain temporary hit points. The horde takes a maximum of 10 points of damage from any source that effects only a single target.
When reduced to 0 hit points, the horde disperses; some archers are slain, others are wounded or routing. At the DM’s discretion, 2d4 unwounded archers may take the place of the horde after it is defeated.
Other than taking damage, the horde is immune to any effect or spell that does not affect an area of at least 20 by 20 ft., or that affects only a finite number of creatures within an area. DM’s discretion and common sense is required here.
A medium or smaller creature can be attacked only once per turn by a horde. A large creature can be attacked twice. A huge or gargantuan creature can be attacked up to three times.

Multiattack. The horde makes two attacks, or one attack if the horde has half of its hit points or fewer.
Slings and arrows. Ranged Weapon Attack: +10 to hit, reach 5 ft., one target. Hit: 17 (3d10+1) piercing damage.
Swords and daggers. Melee Weapon Attack: +10 to hit, range 150/600 ft., one target. Hit: 11 (3d6+1) slashing damage.
Rain of Arrows (Recharge 5-6). The horde unleashes a terrible volley of arrows at a point within 400 ft. of it. Each creature within 40 ft. of that point must make a DC 13 Dexterity saving throw, taking 36 (8d8) piercing damage on a failed save, or half as much damage on a successful one.

The ranges on "Swords and Spears" and "Slings and Arrows" appear to be reversed.

 

[GX.Sigma]

Maybe "host" would be a better word. "Horde" has certain connotations.

 

[bleezy]

Looks like an interesting blend of regular characters and the swarm rules.

Did you ever see the Legends and Lore article on mass combat?
http://archive.wizards.com/DnD/Article.aspx?x=dnd/4ll/20140428
I imagine something close to this will be in the DMG.

This looks like a very interesting system, and frankly it seems to be better than mine. Thanks for the link! This would be the very first time mass combat rules have made it into the DMG, correct?

But what would happen in this system if I cast a fireball at a stack of 10 orcs? I suppose they would get a single saving throw and the stack would take normal damage. But that shouldn't be my only action for 10 rounds. I should theoretically be able to cast 10 fireballs in the time it would take me to one single target attack against the stack. I would rule that a spellcaster could cast 5 spells in a one minute round and still make a cantrip or weapon attack at disadvantage, OR cast up to ten spells and take no other action.

 

[Grainger]

This would be the very first time mass combat rules have made it into the DMG, correct?

Depends on what you call a DMG. The old Companion set's DM booklet (1984) had an excellent mass combat rules system called The War Machine that didn't require miniatures to resolve battles. This version of D&D didn't have a single-volume DMG, but the aforementioned DM's Companion was effectively one quarter of the system's DMG.

 

[Dausuul]

I've tried building mass combat systems for D&D-like games, and it's a real can of worms.

IMO, the best solution (and it ain't easy!) is to design a system that emphasizes "decision points" within the battle. The idea is that the game should focus on what the PCs are doing; showdowns with the enemy commanders, missions to seize key locations or scout the enemy, defeating siege monsters. The rest of the battle takes place in the background, using a highly abstracted system to resolve, with the "decision points" having a big influence on the outcome.

Trying to model mass combat in round-by-round detail, the way D&D models skirmish combat, never seems to turn out well.

 

[Grainger]

I've tried building mass combat systems for D&D-like games, and it's a real can of worms.

IMO, the best solution (and it ain't easy!) is to design a system that emphasizes "decision points" within the battle. The idea is that the game should focus on what the PCs are doing; showdowns with the enemy commanders, missions to seize key locations or scout the enemy, defeating siege monsters. The rest of the battle takes place in the background, using a highly abstracted system to resolve, with the "decision points" having a big influence on the outcome.

Trying to model mass combat in round-by-round detail, the way D&D models skirmish combat, never seems to turn out well.

That's how BECMI recommended doing it. It had a system to resolve the battle as a whole, but it recommended that adventurers might spend time before the battle (or, I suppose, during) doing missions like the ones you mention.

 

[Tormyr]

This looks like a very interesting system, and frankly it seems to be better than mine. Thanks for the link! This would be the very first time mass combat rules have made it into the DMG, correct?

But what would happen in this system if I cast a fireball at a stack of 10 orcs? I suppose they would get a single saving throw and the stack would take normal damage. But that shouldn't be my only action for 10 rounds. I should theoretically be able to cast 10 fireballs in the time it would take me to one single target attack against the stack. I would rule that a spellcaster could cast 5 spells in a one minute round and still make a cantrip or weapon attack at disadvantage, OR cast up to ten spells and take no other action.

I think the "1 minute" part of it is the weakest part. It may be simpler to consider it to be a "normal" round. The downside of that is that movement will be slowed down. I imagine that if it did make it in the DMG that they did some fine tuning of issues like that. In 1 month we will know.

EDIT: I went back and reread the article again. Solos only get one attack against a stand because stands have the same hp as 1 creature. So essentially, the solo is making 10 hits or misses with 1 attack roll. I think it was supposed to be a different kind of abstraction of combat rather than a simple scaling up of regular D&D combat. A stand, on the other hand gets as many attacks as creatures in it when attacking just the one solo. leaving a solo on the battlefield all alone could be a very bad idea.

A solo wizard only gets to fire 1 fireball in a round, which functions a little differently, but once again, I think the battlefield rules are a different beast, and we do not know what final form they will take. A stand of wizards firing fireball would be severely nerfed in that they would only roll damage once (unless against a solo?). It may be that magic in general breaks the system and magic users have to be solos. We shall see.

 

[bleezy]

A solo wizard only gets to fire 1 fireball in a round, which functions a little differently, but once again, I think the battlefield rules are a different beast, and we do not know what final form they will take. A stand of wizards firing fireball would be severely nerfed in that they would only roll damage once (unless against a solo?). It may be that magic in general breaks the system and magic users have to be solos. We shall see.

But there needs to be a significant advantage to using area attacks against a stand. If I cast a cantrip at a stand, that actually represents me casting it ten times over the course of a minute. That why the damage affects the entire stack, instead of just 1/10th of it. That's abstract, sure, but it makes sense to me. But fireball should affect the entire stack yet only take 1 action (6 seconds) to cast. So a wizard who could cast five fireballs should be able to easily obliterate 50+ orcs in a minute. That's the whole point of area spells.

If a wizard casts disintegrate or finger of death at a stack (a waste of a good spell), it should do a maximum of (max stack HP)/(number of creatures in the stack) but it should still only take 6 seconds. Area spells should do their full damage to a stack.

Likewise, a fighter should be able to do something like drink a potion or blow a horn of blasting without wasting a full minute.

Maybe it would be best to let every solo take one standard action and also attack one stack (or multiattack one stack), or just take 10 regular turns and not be able to attack any stacks. OR you make the PC actually fight out a 10 round fight against the surrounding monsters if he wants to take any action other than just moving or attacking a stack.

Also, these rules don't seem to deal with ranged attacks well. Being surrounded by troops shouldn't protect a PC from archers because 1) the arrows will be coming from above and 2) archers on the battlefield won't be shooting at any particular soldier, they will be attacking an area.