Metamagic Question

[Khelvan]

If one casts an Fireball modified wit the repeat Spell feat and uses
sudden maximize on the Fireball.
Is the repeated Fireball then maximized or does the sudden max only affect the first spell?


Thanks

Khelvan

 

[Folly]

I would think it would be. My reasons for this is that when you use a sudden feat, it applies the metamagic feat to the spell. Thus you were casting repeat fireball, but in using the sudden feat it became a maximized repeat fireball.

 

[ElectricDragon]

I would think it would not be maxed. Once a day means once a day. Repeat Spell is not a way around that rule else it should have more levels attached to it.

Ciao
Dave

 

[irdeggman]

Let's see.

The Sudden Maximize maximizes the spell without increasing the level. 1 time per day.

The Repeat spell repeats the casting of a spell, but the spell level is 3 levels higher than normal.

At best you would cast a maximized fireball that used a 6th level slot and it would repeat on the next round.

It would appear as if it was possible per the RAW since Sudden Maximize doesn't prevent it.

 

[Nifft]

No, because metamagic feats don't interact with each other (see Maximize + Empower for an example).

You get a Maximized fireball on the first round, and then next round you'd get a regular fireball.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Folly]

No, because metamagic feats don't interact with each other (see Maximize + Empower for an example).

You get a Maximized fireball on the first round, and then next round you'd get a regular fireball.

Cheers, -- N

While I understand were your coming from, I do not think it is accurate. If this were true a widen maximized fireball would be 40ft wide with the inner 20ft being maximized and the outer 20ft being normal. This does not seem right to me. Seeing as there are no rules that govern metamagic feat interaction except for the exception in the maximize rule text and that other situations of metamagic feat interaction would imply a different nature of interaction, you need to look at the situation of the interaction. With empower and maximize, empower would have no effect on a maximize spell if not for the exception. As well both feats modify the nature of the damage of the spell. With repeat and maximize, they are modifying two different aspects of the spell.(repeat as to how the spell happens, and maximize for the amount of damage it does) This is not an ironclad arguement, but it does give rise to the other interpretation. If there are more rules on metamagic feat interaction that I am unaware of please point it out so I can have a solid base to work from.

 

[irdeggman]

No, because metamagic feats don't interact with each other (see Maximize + Empower for an example).

You get a Maximized fireball on the first round, and then next round you'd get a regular fireball.

Cheers, -- N

So you can't do a silent stilled spell?

Maximized and Empowered had a specific order of precendence laid out IIRC in the AQ or rules of the game or something like that.

But otherwise you can have more than one metamagic feat applied to a spell at a time.

 

[Nifft]

So you can't do a silent stilled spell?

Of course you can. Those effects don't interact with each other.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Nifft]

While I understand were your coming from, I do not think it is accurate. If this were true a widen maximized fireball would be 40ft wide with the inner 20ft being maximized and the outer 20ft being normal. This does not seem right to me.

I do see where you're coming from here. This is an interesting case, and I'd rule it as I think you would: that Maximize affects the whole spell's damage, and Widen affects the whole spell's area. This would mean the effects of metamagic usually do stack.

However, let's take a closer look at Repeat Spell:

A repeated spell is automatically cast again at the beginning of your turn in the following round. No matter where you might have moved in the previous round, the second spell originates from the same location and affects the same area as the original spell. If the original spell designates a ranged target, the repeated spell affects the same target if it is within 30 feet of its original position; otherwise, the second spell fails. Touch range spells cannot be affected by this feat.

So the second round, the spell is "cast again". Feats you used on the first round should not apply. It's another casting, not a continuation of the first casting.

... but if you'd actually prepared a Maximized Repeat fireball, you'd get two Maximized fireballs.

Hope that puts us on sounder rules ground.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Folly]

I had not looked at the actual text (being at work), but I think you interpreted it correctly Nifft. This is one of those times that due to the specific wording of the abilities it causes an odd consequence.