Monster Manual IV needs errata before its publishing?

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Neither of those posts answer my question; they are extrapolations, which are negated by the appearance of an official NPC that has Martial Weapon: bastard sword.

Also, the (revised) Living Greyhawk deities .PDF has deities whose favored weapon is a bastard sword & have the War domain (Kelanen & Mayaheine); it lists the favored weapon as bastard sword (m), where the "m" indicates martial. So those clerics that take the War domain would have Martial Weapon: bastard sword.

So again, where do the core rules state that a bastard sword can't be chosen for the Martial Weapon Proficiency feat?

Where does it say you can take it as a martial weapon? It is only listed as a exotic weapon in the equipment list.

If the MM4 monster manual can be wrong, then can be other source books that could give us an insight into that matter.

All that said: I think the matter with the MM4 monster is relatively easy:
Its entry lists it as wielding the weapon one-handed? Then obviously:
"Proficient with all simple weapons and any weapons mentioned in its entry."
applies and it is proficient with the Bastard Sword...

PS: I changed the second sentence from martial to exotic. I probably shouldn't have posted at that time and that room temperature

 

[Egres]

Just in case someone missed it:

So, are you saying that a charactetr that has all the MWP is not proficient with all martial weapons?

By your reasoning, a fighter could wield a bastard sword two handed without penalties, while a bard that spent thousand of feats in every single MWP in the game could not.

That's illogical.

If I'm proficient with all the martial weapons the game has, I'm proficient in all martial weapons.

Plain and simple.

I can't really see how you can argument the opposite.

 

[calypso15]

Just in case someone missed it:

We didn't miss it. We pointed out that Bastard Sword is an exotic weapon, not a martial weapon. In case you missed it.

Calypso

 

[Hypersmurf]

By your reasoning, a fighter could wield a bastard sword two handed without penalties, while a bard that spent thousand of feats in every single MWP in the game could not.

That's illogical.

Remember, as soon as a sourcebook containing another martial weapon is published, the fighter is proficient with it; the bard is not.

There is an inherent difference between "Taking lots of feats" and being proficient in all martial weapons.

-Hyp.

 

[Infiniti2000]

Especially since a sorcerer can't use it as a martial weapon at all, given that he only has proficiency in simple weapons. Or rather, he can, but he'd suffer non-proficiency penalty. There has to be an intermediary step for this to work, which is what MWP bastard sword would be. Nobody in their right mind, of course, would that that unless they couldn't somehow take EWP bastard sword (or got it as a bonus feat, such as with the War domain).

Why does there have to be an intermediate step? There's no MWP prerequisite for EWP.

As for the inapplicability of MWP (bastard sword), what will you do now for the poor cleric of a deity with whip as a favored weapon? He gets MWP (whip), so what does that do?

 

[Land Outcast]

So... said bard wouldn't eever be able to wield the Bastard Sword two handed without the -4 nonproficiency penalty?

 

[Infiniti2000]

So... said bard wouldn't eever be able to wield the Bastard Sword two handed without the -4 nonproficiency penalty?

Why not take EWP (bsword)? When did that cease to be an option?

 

[Abraxas]

So... said bard wouldn't eever be able to wield the Bastard Sword two handed without the -4 nonproficiency penalty?

Why not take EWP (bsword)? When did that cease to be an option?

Wouldn't EWP (bsword) only allow the charater to wield a bastard sword proficiently one handed?

 

[Hypersmurf]

Wouldn't EWP (bsword) only allow the charater to wield a bastard sword proficiently one handed?

A one-handed weapon can be wielded in one hand or two hands.

-Hyp.

 

[saucercrab]

They are not extrapolations. The two quotes from the rules are:

From MWP: "Choose a type of martial weapon."

From Sword, Bastard: "...it is an exotic weapon."

The full quote on page 121 of the PHB is, "Bastard Swords are also known as hand-&-a-half swords. A bastard sword is to large to use in one hand without special training; thus it is an exotic weapon. A character can use a bastard sword two-handed as a martial weapon."

That doesn't say it can't be selected as a martial weapon proficiency. That indicates how it is an exotic weapon & a martial weapon.

The fact that "A character can use a bastard sword two-handed as a martial weapon" does not make the weapon itself martial. You cannot choose a non-martial weapon for MWP.

In spite of the fact that I've listed two official sources to the contrary, one of which is a revised 3.5 Living Greyhawk document. :\