Most frustrating quirk of 5E?

[Maxperson]

Eh. I wouldn't consider it a rule (house or otherwise), just like I don't consider it a game rule for the DM to say "You can build a flimsy raft out of sticks, but not a full-size ocean-worthy galleon, no matter what tools or skills you have." It's just one of those things that the rules don't specify because it's assumed the DM is actually participating in the game.

The difference here for me is that exhaustion limiting the amount of combat you can partake in is mechanical in nature. Mechanics are always rules. So for me house mechanics = house rules.

Now, you might feel otherwise, and that's obviously fine. I don't think there's anything to be gained from us getting into a nitpicky debate about what "counts" as a rule. (This ain't the rope trick thread. ) But that's where I'm coming from with it, and what I mean when I say I personally wouldn't even consider it as a house rule.

I hear you. Not arguing you about it being a house rule or not. Just saying that the above is why I would consider it a house rule.

 

[Immoralkickass]

The rules for death saves and being downed. Most people are more annoyed at the whack-a-mole style of Downed state and getting up with 1 hp. For me, I am more annoyed at this: Take 35 damage from a fireball while downed = 1 failed death save. Getting punched for 2 damage while downed = 2 failed death saves.

 

[SkidAce]

The rules for death saves and being downed. Most people are more annoyed at the whack-a-mole style of Downed state and getting up with 1 hp. For me, I am more annoyed at this: Take 35 damage from a fireball while downed = 1 failed death save. Getting punched for 2 damage while downed = 2 failed death saves.

I agree with you, I guess they are thinking the punch is directly specifically at one target, so is more "dangerous".

Maybe you're at the "edge" of the fireball.

/shrugs.

 

[Blue]

The rules for death saves and being downed. Most people are more annoyed at the whack-a-mole style of Downed state and getting up with 1 hp. For me, I am more annoyed at this: Take 35 damage from a fireball while downed = 1 failed death save. Getting punched for 2 damage while downed = 2 failed death saves.

I can see that. Would a threshold for damage before it gives a failed death save help? Something like it needs to do Level + CON mod damage or it doesn't count as a failed death save?

Or maybe nothing is an auto-failed death save, but if you take damage you need to make a CON save vs. the damage taken to avoid another failed death save.

 

[Aridon]

Hi, first post but long time lurker.

First off let me state I really enjoy 5e, however there are a few quirks that I really dislike. Also, some of these are likely already mentioned but I haven’t yet had time to read through all of the 5e quirks listed in this thread.
1. The overnight heal is just ridiculous. In fact, in our group we mockingly call it “moonbeam” healing and have home ruled it out of the game, replacing it with Con bonus +1, min 1 healing per night.
2. Whack a mole healing in combat. Our group left that in, but added a level of exhaustion for each time a character is dropped to 0 HP.
3. Spells not listed by class, or even listing the classes that can cast them within the spells “stat block”.
4. The index is the Platonic form of how not to do an index. Enough said.
5. Magic item descriptions were not properly reviewed, leading to incomplete descriptions (see Bag of Tricks as an example).
6. SS and GWM feats are seriously broken.
7. Every class has a caster, resulting in magic not being special, even if some are seriously suboptimal (looking at you Way of the Four Elements monk.)
8. Weak skills system and tool proficiencies.
9. 6 to 8 encounters per day. That only makes sense in a dungeon.
10. While I love cantrips they are out of balance for Clerics vs using a melee weapon. Seriously, why would a cleric even bother to carry a weapon.
11. No speed factor on weapons. Weapons in 5e are rather dull and adding a speed factor would help differentiate them.
12. Save every round spells.
13. No real tank class. I’d love a class ability that allowed a character to really tank.
14. Intelligence is a dump stat. While this is a game, in what sort of twisted reality would intelligence be a dump stat, and don’t get me started on the multiclass shenanigans that can be played using this editions super casting stat, Charisma.
15. Darkvision’s ubiquity.
16. Every race getting only bonuses, and no gender differences. I loved 1e and 2e’s gender customizations, but in the PC era we live in I guess they had to go.
While these quirks really annoy me and the group I adventure with, we all agree that 5e has much more going for it than against it. It is the best version of D&D in a while, at least in our opinion.

 

[Mepher]

Hi, first post but long time lurker.

First off let me state I really enjoy 5e, however there are a few quirks that I really dislike. Also, some of these are likely already mentioned but I haven’t yet had time to read through all of the 5e quirks listed in this thread.
1. The overnight heal is just ridiculous. In fact, in our group we mockingly call it “moonbeam” healing and have home ruled it out of the game, replacing it with Con bonus +1, min 1 healing per night.
2. Whack a mole healing in combat. Our group left that in, but added a level of exhaustion for each time a character is dropped to 0 HP.
3. Spells not listed by class, or even listing the classes that can cast them within the spells “stat block”.
4. The index is the Platonic form of how not to do an index. Enough said.
5. Magic item descriptions were not properly reviewed, leading to incomplete descriptions (see Bag of Tricks as an example).
6. SS and GWM feats are seriously broken.
7. Every class has a caster, resulting in magic not being special, even if some are seriously suboptimal (looking at you Way of the Four Elements monk.)
8. Weak skills system and tool proficiencies.
9. 6 to 8 encounters per day. That only makes sense in a dungeon.
10. While I love cantrips they are out of balance for Clerics vs using a melee weapon. Seriously, why would a cleric even bother to carry a weapon.
11. No speed factor on weapons. Weapons in 5e are rather dull and adding a speed factor would help differentiate them.
12. Save every round spells.
13. No real tank class. I’d love a class ability that allowed a character to really tank.
14. Intelligence is a dump stat. While this is a game, in what sort of twisted reality would intelligence be a dump stat, and don’t get me started on the multiclass shenanigans that can be played using this editions super casting stat, Charisma.
15. Darkvision’s ubiquity.
16. Every race getting only bonuses, and no gender differences. I loved 1e and 2e’s gender customizations, but in the PC era we live in I guess they had to go.
While these quirks really annoy me and the group I adventure with, we all agree that 5e has much more going for it than against it. It is the best version of D&D in a while, at least in our opinion.

You sound similar to me in your assessment of the game. Even though I am our full time DM, I have struggled with 5E after coming from a 25+ year AD&D background. I chose to switch us to 5E and now my players love it while I still struggle, go figure. I have realized that once our current Forgotten Realms campaign ends I will be returning to my homebrew world, running 5th edition but I will house rule it to the version I want. Many of the things you listed there will change but that is the beauty of D&D, we can change anything we want in our own games.

 

[5ekyu]

I can see that. Would a threshold for damage before it gives a failed death save help? Something like it needs to do Level + CON mod damage or it doesn't count as a failed death save?

Or maybe nothing is an auto-failed death save, but if you take damage you need to make a CON save vs. the damage taken to avoid another failed death save.

To me the fly in the ointmrntbis the crit. Drop that so each damage is a fail, just one, and it gets ok, imo.

 

[5ekyu]

Hi, first post but long time lurker.

First off let me state I really enjoy 5e, however there are a few quirks that I really dislike. Also, some of these are likely already mentioned but I haven’t yet had time to read through all of the 5e quirks listed in this thread.
1.The overnight heal is just ridiculous. In fact, in our group we mockingly call it “moonbeam” healing and have home ruled it out of the game, replacing it with Con bonus +1, min 1 healing per night.
2.Whack a mole healing in combat. Our group left that in, but added a level of exhaustion for each time a character is dropped to 0 HP.
3.Spells not listed by class, or even listing the classes that can cast them within the spells “stat block”.
4.The index is the Platonic form of how not to do an index. Enough said.
5.Magic item descriptions were not properly reviewed, leading to incomplete descriptions (see Bag of Tricks as an example).
6.SS and GWM feats are seriously broken.
7.Every class has a caster, resulting in magic not being special, even if some are seriously suboptimal (looking at you Way of the Four Elements monk.)
8.Weak skills system and tool proficiencies.
9.6 to 8 encounters per day. That only makes sense in a dungeon.
10.While I love cantrips they are out of balance for Clerics vs using a melee weapon. Seriously, why would a cleric even bother to carry a weapon.
11.No speed factor on weapons. Weapons in 5e are rather dull and adding a speed factor would help differentiate them.
12.Save every round spells.
13.No real tank class. I’d love a class ability that allowed a character to really tank.
14.Intelligence is a dump stat. While this is a game, in what sort of twisted reality would intelligence be a dump stat, and don’t get me started on the multiclass shenanigans that can be played using this editions super casting stat, Charisma.
15.Darkvision’s ubiquity.
16.Every race getting only bonuses, and no gender differences. I loved 1e and 2e’s gender customizations, but in the PC era we live in I guess they had to go.
While these quirks really annoy me and the group I adventure with, we all agree that 5e has much more going for it than against it. It is the best version of D&D in a while, at least in our opinion.

Interesting... curious about your results with these, if you are inclined to share.

Regarding 9, the 6-8, since it's just an expression of an estimation of how long a party can go without running low on resources and not a rule or even a recommendation/requirement for anyone's game to follow or strive to, it has not affected my game in the least even tho I never used it.
How did it affect yours?

"1.The overnight heal is just ridiculous. In fact, in our group we mockingly call it “moonbeam” healing and have home ruled it out of the game, replacing it with Con bonus +1, min 1 healing per night."

How was your game different after you made that change in actual play? What good or bad results came from the change? Did it add a whole extra day of healing to some of the the most heavy of battles (assuming spending half-HD and then healing spells) or not even that?

"2.Whack a mole healing in combat. Our group left that in, but added a level of exhaustion for each time a character is dropped to 0 HP."

How was your game different after you made that change in actual play? What good or bad results came from the change? Did this discourage pressing on once someone got an unlucky drop and drive towards more short workdays or did they fight on with exhaustion? Did it encourage leaving someone down and making saves as opposed to getting them up and risking another hit dropping them again producing a second level of exhaustion?

 

[Dausuul]

The difference here for me is that exhaustion limiting the amount of combat you can partake in is mechanical in nature. Mechanics are always rules. So for me house mechanics = house rules.

It's not really a house rule to say "Guys, you can't swing a hammer continuously for a week." There aren't any mechanics involved in that statement. If you came up with a system for calculating how long you could swing a hammer, and applying exhaustion after certain thresholds, that would be a house rule.

Incidentally, if we're talking rules, casting spells is a strenuous activity - it's on the list of activities that can interrupt a long rest. So we can presume that it is at least as tiring as physical exertion.

 

[3catcircus]

Where to begin. Well - I'm kinda annoyed by *most* of the D&D rules as they've progressed over the editions, so 5e isn't unique in that regard. I think the biggest quirk is that they haven't figured out how to provide a set of rules that consistently applies damage and healing across a broad spectrum of effects. Everything is *still* "I magic missile him and do x points of damage. The BBEG continues merrily along even though he is down to 3 hit points. The fighter attacks with his sword and does 4 points of damage and now the BBEG suddenly collapses. Fight over."

Yes, it is fantasy, but I want a consistent set of rules options beyond the normal rules that would clearly distinguish how different attacks and damage types would affect an opponent in such a fashion that their combat effectiveness (and even their willingness to continue in battle instead of fleeing) would be "realistically" impacted, if the campaign is a low magic or gritty setting. In such situations, a guy who gets blasted by a fireball oughta be lights out most of the time due to going into shock almost instantaneously. A guy getting sliced across the leg that is more than a superficial wound ought to have a chance of bleeding out from the femoral artery or have a chance of being hobbled (and would definitely have his mobility impacted), and a guy bashed in the skull with a mace ought to have a chance of being knocked senseless.

It doesn't have to be all that complicated to do so - add hit locations / divide up hit points per location and maybe determine certain trip points for damage that would result in additional penalties, checks to see if you go into shock or start bleeding out, etc.

Runequest figured this out to a certain degree decades ago, and the 2013 edition of Twilight:2000 had a very nice system (albeit geared primarily towards combat involving firearms).