Multiattack

[glass]

Where? I was pointing out that your 'might be able to polymorph at some point in his life' argument was a straw man. I don't see want answer there could be to that (except perhaps 'sorry'), and I don't see any sort of answer to it.

There's a point and it's not a strawman at all.

You said:

At worst, it allows for anyone to take multiattack as long as they can polymorph or eventually polymorph (at some point in their lifetime) into a creature with 3 natural attacks.

Since my arguments explicitly required the character to be polymorphed/wildshaped/whatever at the time they needed to meet the pre-requisites, that does not follow. You described a position that was superficially similar to mine, but which was easier for you to argue against. That is the very essence of a straw man.


glass.

 

[Lord Pendragon]

Can a druid who can wildshape (but doesn't have 3 or more natural attacks on its own) take the multiattack feat?

No. There is a precedent for feats that can grant abilities based on Wildshape, [Wild] feats, introduced in The Complete Divine. Such feats require either Wildshape or a specific version of Wildshape (such as the ability to wildshape into a Large creature), and then provide some kind of bonus.

Multiattack is not such a feat. It requires that you have three natural weapons, not that you have "the ability to acquire" three natural weapons.

 

[glass]

Multiattack is not such a feat. It requires that you have three natural weapons, not that you have "the ability to acquire" three natural weapons.

But if you have 'the ability to acquire' three natural weapons, then you can have, so long as you use that ability.


glass.

 

[Infiniti2000]

You implied that I agreed with you, but was too stupid to know the difference between 'yes' and 'no'.

I honestly intended no such insult. I apologize for the confusion. I should have simply typed, "I disagree."

 

[IcyCool]

It depends on the prerequisites of the feats, but assuming you meet them, you could take either. Heck, if you've never even seen a dire flail before, you could take EWP(dire flail). There's no restriction on the prerequisite (besides the BAB +1 which we can assume is met). Do you really dispute this per the RAW?

Not at all, did I say that I did?

I can't say whether I have a point of contention unless you tell me what we are debating. Let me know if you are discussing the rules (or lack thereof) on levelling up or the way I run it.

More a curiousity on how you run it. I've seen a few of the "No you can't do this folks" refer to training as the reason you couldn't.

 

[Coredump]

(Having seen this discussion before....)

Infinity: I think the point presented, is that rules such as DnD tend to assume you can do things, unless restricted otherwise. The DM is free to 'rule 0' additional restrictions, but otherwise, you are free to do what you want.

Glass: The problem with allowing 'instantaneous' leveling, whenever you want: My character borrows the mage's headband of intellect +4, and gets the cleric to cast (insert name of Int buff), now I get 4 more skill points, and then give the headband back.
I am sure there are other examples of (ab)using this ruling.


Personally, I don't use the 'instantaneous' ruling, but I also allow Druid multiattack. The way I see it, the wildshape form *is* the druid, so from my perspective, he *does* have 3 attacks per round, if he chooses to take that form.

 

[IcyCool]

Glass: The problem with allowing 'instantaneous' leveling, whenever you want: My character borrows the mage's headband of intellect +4, and gets the cleric to cast (insert name of Int buff), now I get 4 more skill points, and then give the headband back.
I am sure there are other examples of (ab)using this ruling.

To my knowledge, it's been stated that the Headband of Intellect doesn't grant you extra skill points. I don't know if Fox's Cunning has been likewise clarified.

 

[kmdietri]

I may just rule that the character can take the feat when they have enough times per day and duration to essentially stay wildshaped permanently.

 

[wuyanei]

How about a compromise? "You can take a feat if you manage to meet all of the feats requirements for more than 4 hours per day on average."

4 hrs/day is more than enough time to satisfy the 'training' rational (even the best and most diligent fighter will not practice swordswinging for 24 hrs a day!), but still long enough to prevent polymorph or item swapping abuse. Druids, who start at 5 hrs / day, automatically qualify with wildshape. If you must have training, you can just say that the druid wildshapes and then trains in her animal form regularly (ie 'off screen').

So. What do you guys say about that?

 

[IcyCool]

So. What do you guys say about that?

Sounds like a fine houserule to me.