My 7th level party just killed a young adult dragon!

[Left-handed Hummingbird]

In this, as in many other things, the way forward is the golden mean. I think we all agree, clockworkjoe, that one of the points of the game is that the players are having fun. But that isn't guaranteed by a strict no-fudging policy. I agree with you that the DM should expect any adventure to go exactly as he or she had planned, but experienced DMs know what the players will think is fun and what not, Thus, the DM should allow him or her to trust their intuition and fudge a roll if he or she believes in and is confident that the consequences if the roll isn't fudged would be unduly disruptive.

Remember, too, that while the players should have fun, so should the DM, and the two isn't mutually exclusive: If the DM has spent weeks preparing an adventure, a little unconspicious fudging is quite allowed, in my humble opinion, if it makes the players experience the great scenarios prepared by the DM which they would have missed otherwise.

 

[Wolfspider]

Your characters just happened to have a dragon-sized helm of opposite alignment, eh? Yeah, I know, it's supposed to change size, but I think there are some limitations....

Reapersaurus, you and I should form an organization. We should call it B.A.D.D--Bothered About Disposable Dragons. What do you think?

 

[~Joseph~]

I still would like to know what you turned it into

and I've found that DMs, not really wanting to kill his players off, doesn't play monsters to their full advantage. I have players killing monsters 2 or 3 CR above their levels, but I could easily kill them off with a creature of lower CR. It all depends on how effectively the monster is played by the DM.

 

[Thorntangle]

I still would like to know what you turned it into

It's really moot and I'll explain why. When it failed its save I blurted out, "It's a worm!" since I was thinking of the KotSQ episode where Jamison Crow turned one of the Hill Giants into a worm and put it in his pocket for later. Even if this isn't strictly kosher by the rules (and I'm sure someone will have something to say about this), it was hovering over a river of waste with the consistency of crude oil at the time. As long as a chose a form without the ability to fly or swim, it was gone. Dave the DM was flabbergasted and just declared it dead.

 

[Wolfspider]

Heh. Another name for dragon is worm. I can imagine that an evil DM might have used that little tidbit to interesting effect....

 

[Voneth]

Worm is sort of generic. If the DM wanted to, he could have found ways to have the critter survive. Several species of worm swim, dig, hiberinate, and breathe through primitive lungs or their entire skin surface.

In fact, who says the critter didn't die and everyone just assumed it was dead since it didn't immediately attack back.

Now the party has a unassuming worm with the intellegence, durablity and urge of revenge of a dragon.

It could be ... anywhere.

I dare you to show this post to your DM.

 

[Wolfspider]

Man...I'd hate to wake up with that worm in my small intestine....

 

[James McMurray]

Since Wolfspider mentioned it on my dragon thread, I figured I'd better chime in.

I see absolutely no reason why SOME dragons should not be portrayed as overconfident. If they're young, and unwise, they may see their being part of the "ultimate race" as proof of their superiority.

If they've only lived in the wild, and never shared space with a larger predator, they would obviously believe themselves king of the walk.

If the only humans they've dealt with are villagers, they may not realize that there are "talking monkeys" that can hurt them.

Sure, by the time they're older, they'll be more experienced in the ways of the world, but until then. . .


As for the original topic, I have to agree with clokworkjoe and left-handed hummingbird: things like that happen ina fair game.

 

[Oni]

Hmm.

It WASN'T the spell that killed it? Maybe i misread the part where the wizard flew, then cast Polymorph Other.[/i]

I won't deny tha the the polymorph other spell is what put the dragon out of commission, but the fact that the wizard was able to escape and target it in that short amount of time speaks less of the power of the spells at his command and more of the poor tactics the dragon choose to use*. I will not presume to put words into the mouth of the original poster, but I it is my opinion that the weight of his post is given to the lack of tactics on the part of the dragon rather than the nature of the spell that took it down.


*I'm speaking of the choice in character the dragon made. Even if the dragon had a reason for being cocky and not fighting to its full potential it did still use sub-optimal tactics. Beyond the reason why, I think its hard to argue the fact that it did fight poorly. (A state of mind which would lead me to believe a -1 reduction to its CR would at least be appropriate, but that is only my humble opinion.

 

[Altalazar]

I don't buy the notion that a Dragon would just automatically know about the lethality of spellcasters.

How would it know? It hatches and goes off on its own. It certainly hasn't got a formal education. And perhaps the first time it has the chance to learn about the lethality of spellcasters, it is too late.

Which brings up a whole different question - just where DOES a dragon get its knowledge?