New 3.5 Base Classes-The Return

[Staffan]

Oriental Adventures has a "divine sorcerer" class in the Shugenja. They come with a bunch of elemental "baggage", though.

 

[Urbannen]

Well, one archetype that hasn't been addressed in standard D&D is the miracle-working/curse-throwing priest/holy man/etc. that doesn't engage in much combat. I believe there are classes like this in some d20 books, however.

Another archetype is the feminine aristocrat. The current aristocrat NPC class gets heavy armor proficiency, I believe. I think there should be an aristocrat NPC class for aristocrats (mainly women) that aren't expected to engage in melee.

 

[RodneyThompson]

2. Class name: Commander. Role: The Leader. Rationale: there needs to be a party-support character that can lend a direct hand in the fight. I picture this class as a heavy-armoured combatant with +1/lvl BAB, good Fort and Will saves, d10 HP, 2 skill points, and access to Diplomacy, Spot, Profession: Soldier, Intimidate, and Sense Motive. For special abilities it'll have Inspire Courage (speech and orders, not music) and the Paladin's Fear immunity/bonus to saves for companions, but no spells. This will help serve those high-charisma martial-minded characters that don't want to be godly champions or musicians. Think "paladin" or "bard", without the Ethos or the jive.

Then I have just the thing for you, my friend! The upcoming Noble's Handbook from Green Ronin publishing, part of their Master Class line, will give you just exactly what you need. There is a Commander prestige class included that is your typical military commander and is decked out to lead a party in combat.

Also, the Noble class itself is built around helping out the rest of the party, so a multiclassed Noble/Fighter will give you exactly what you need. I think you'll want to check it out.

 

[Zhure]

In Dragon 308 the fighter can now choose Improved Grapple, Deflect Arrows, Snatch Arrows, and Stunning Fist as bonus feats, with Improved Unarmed strike as a prerequisite. So there is some new advantages to taking Improved Unarmed strike as a fighter, but the damage would still suck.

I dunno, with specialization, the +2 to damage means the 1d4 unarmed a medium-sized character gets boosts his average damage to 4.5 -- the same as a d8. Start with 1 level of monk for the pugilist and the 1d6+2 for specialization grants an average of 5.5, akin to a 1d10 average.

The real problem is without taking monk, the unarmed damage is subdual only unless you take a -4 to hit. There ought to be a feat to overcome that. The Fighter's bonus feats and better BAB can theoretically make him a better unarmed fighter than a monk until very high levels.

Greg

 

[Anubis the Doomseer]

i don't like the idea of a "Commander" base class. the ability to lead masses of troops into combat should be earned, not handed out to newbie 1st level characters.

this concept works much better as a prestige class IMO.

Alderac's Mercenaries had a feat 'Battle Cry' that would fit the leader-type character, even at 1st level. Penumbra's Uncommon Character had two (broken, but fixable) feats that would do much the same thing. I agree - the "Leader" is someone who is more than level 1 - look at the examples cited in the arguments in favour: a general with years of experience in the legions, a highly-charismatic barbarian/fighter, and definitely bard-like ranger types (Robin Hood is a leader/archer - are we going to need a base class for that as well?).

I agree - a spontaneous divine caster would be good, a non-rogue skill master would also good (actually just give the Expert a class ability to gradually relax the max skill rank cap and it's a PC class), and a non-magical lay healer class (with class abilities to simulate magical healing) would all be great additions. Everything else could be done with multiclasses, prestige classes and RECIPES (anyone other me remember that these things were supposed to be part of 3e?!).

- Ma'at

 

[Shadow64]

just a thought

Although it doesn't fit in with "the rules" as building a new class would, why not just adapt the skills packs used in the d20 version of Call of Cthulhu?

I'm not saying it's an easy solution (i can think of 2 or 3 ways to implement this, but w/o testing i don't know which way would be best) - but it would seem to nick a lot of these multiclass problems in the bud.

 

[bwgwl]

Another archetype is the feminine aristocrat. The current aristocrat NPC class gets heavy armor proficiency, I believe. I think there should be an aristocrat NPC class for aristocrats (mainly women) that aren't expected to engage in melee.

the trouble is, in most societies with aristocracies, the aristocratic women weren't expected to do much of anything at all.

 

[Zaruthustran]

i don't like the idea of a "Commander" base class. the ability to lead masses of troops into combat should be earned, not handed out to newbie 1st level characters.

this concept works much better as a prestige class IMO.

Good point, I applied the same argument to the Paladin class. I think a warrior personally called by a god should be a prestige class. But then somebody argued that Joan of Arc, and Galahad, and a few other icons were all basically 1st level.

I feel the same way about this proposed Commander class. Sure, the general in Gladiator was high level, but Mel Gibson's Braveheart was just a farmer. There are plenty examples in history and fiction of otherwise average schmoes achieving great things just because they had the guts to say "Follow me!"

Maybe higher level Commanders (or a prestige class) will have the ability to positively influence more than a party, or command armies. What I had in mind for this proposed base class was something smaller scale--a character with a +1 BAB/level that had the fear-qualling and party-boosting abilities of the Bard and Paladin, but without the singing, spells, smites, and holiness.

For class abilities I had something like this in mind:

LEVEL ABILITY
1 Inspire Comrades (Bless effect, as bard).
2 Inspire Competance (Bonus to a specific skill checks, as Bard, lasts for 1 minute/level)
3 Quell Fear (Bonus to Fear saves 15' radius, also applies to self)
4 Intimidate. As the Fist of Hextor ability (can scare opponents)
5 "Don't you die on me!" (stabilize nearby comrades with sheer power of command, supernatural ability)
(higher level: Ambush, which effectively gives the Expert Tactician feat to everyone but only during a Surprise round.)

And so on. Instead of music or divine grace, the Commander's party-boosting effects are conveyed through his presence and through encouraging speeches. He's a coach. He's Hannibal from the A-Team. He's a charismatic fighter.

Sure, you can do this by multiclassing--you can also do Bard, Ranger, Druid, and Paladin by multiclassing. I'm just tossing out ideas for what might be the new base classes in the Miniatures handbook. We know there'll be new classes--but what could they be?

-z

 

[Zaruthustran]

Morrus posted a front-page link to thread about the new base classes, so I thought I'd bump this discussion so as to try to stave off repetition of old arguements. It'd be great if the mods could merge this and the "scoop" thread.

-z

 

[Skade]

I feel the same way about this proposed Commander class. Sure, the general in Gladiator was high level, but Mel Gibson's Braveheart was just a farmer. There are plenty examples in history and fiction of otherwise average schmoes achieving great things just because they had the guts to say "Follow me!"

Gibson's character in Braveheart may have begun his life as a farmer, and may have prefered to live as one, but he was not merely one. His time in the French-Indian war was a hrd one, fought over several years, and a great deal of land. One of the reasons he was able to survive that war was his great skill in the wilderness, tracking, hunting, survival and stealth skills. Just the sort of thing that a ranger should have.