D&D (2024) New stealth rules.

[Remathilis]

Its an indirect buff to martials. Didn't we want martials to do fantastical things? Well now a level 1 rogue can go invisible fairly consistently.

Community: We want martial abilities to match magic!
WotC: ok, stealth works similar to the Invisibility spell.
Community: no, not like that.

 

[Stalker0]

for reference people posted the text of the invisibility spell, to aid in the debate:


invisibility: The Target has the Invisible condition until the spell ends. It ends early if the creature takes damage, casts a spell or makes an attack.

Invisible condition: You have ADV on initiative rolls, you aren't affected by any effect that requires a target to be seen, unless they can somehow see you, and attack rolls against you have disadvantage, while your attack rolls have ADV, unless the creature can see you somehow.

Greater Invis: Same, except it does not end early for attacks, spells, or damage.

 

[Reynard]

I just want to point out that a rule, even in isolation, that causes this much arguing about its implementation is, by definition, a bad rule.

 

[mamba]

Community: We want martial abilities to match magic!
WotC: ok, stealth works similar to the Invisibility spell.
Community: no, not like that.

nothing wrong with any of that exchange

 

[Maxperson]

While working it occurred to me that the ability check rules end most of this. If when a hidden person comes into line of sight with someone the DM just rules the outcome not to be in doubt, it doesn't matter what the hide DC is. Autosuccess will kick in and the hidden person is seen.

 

[mellored]

I find it far more unlikely that a group would be all rogues. Not impossible, but I've personally never witnessed such a thing.

I've not seen all Rogue parties, but I have seen all stealth parties before.

Ranger, Rogue, Monk, Dex paladin.

I suppose the next step of this conversation would be "maybe you but not anyone else",

Yea, probably you and not others.

Still seems clear to me they attempted to simplify stealth into an on/off.

 

[Stalker0]

Also just got the see invisibility spell. And yes see invisibility does knock out stealth…

See Invisibility
"For the duration, you see objects and creatures that have the Invisible condition as if they were visible, and you can see into the Ethereal plane."

 

[Maxperson]

RAI = Rules Are Invisible.

That would actually be an improvement over these rules!

 

[mellored]

While working it occurred to me that the ability check rules end most of this. If when a hidden person comes into line of sight with someone the DM just rules the outcome not to be in doubt, it doesn't matter what the hide DC is. Autosuccess will kick in and the hidden person is seen.

That's not how it's written, but I agree that's how it should be run.

Lose your stealth when you lose cover or obscurement.

 

[mellored]

Also just got the see invisibility spell. And yes see invisibility does knock out stealth…

See Invisibility
"For the duration, you see objects and creatures that have the Invisible condition as if they were visible, and you can see into the Ethereal plane."

I'm ok with that change.