D&D 5E New Unearthed Arcana Today: Giant Themed Class Options and Feats

A new Unearthed Arcana dropped today, focusing on giant-themed player options. "In today’s Unearthed Arcana, we explore character options related to the magic and majesty of giants. This playtest document presents the Path of the Giant barbarian subclass, the Circle of the Primeval druid subclass, the Runecrafter wizard subclass, and a collection of new feats, all for use in Dungeons & Dragons."


New Class options:
  • Barbarian: Path of the Giant
  • Druid: Circle of the Primeval
  • Wizard: Runecrafter Tradition
New Feats:
  • Elemental Touched
  • Ember of the Fire Giant
  • Fury of the Frost Giant
  • Guile of the Cloud Giant
  • Keeness of the Stone Giant
  • Outsized Might
  • Rune Carver Apprentice
  • Rune Carvwr Adept
  • Soul of the Storm Giant
  • Vigor of the Hill Giant
WotC's Jeremy Crawford talks Barbarian Path of the Giant here:

 
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dave2008

Legend
Rolling is desired in sufficient numbers that it won't be going away or even diminished. It will remain one of the default options, which is as it should be. Choices are a good thing. :)
So the satisfaction is not really the %, but your belief that it represents enough people that it will not go away as an option.
 


Faolyn

(she/her)
Exclusivity is not relevant. And you do not get 56% point buy and 43% rolling. There is an X factor in the "other category" that changes both. If you want to dig through that thread to figure out what that percentage is for both point buy and rolling, feel free. That's too much effort. I'm satisfied just knowing that higher than 43% and likely around 50% roll.
So I did indeed decide to go through that thread. Here's what I found:

Seven people said they used standard array, a modified standard array, or gave multiple arrays for the player's to choose from.

Three people said they used either standard array or point buy.

One person said they used the Redrick Roller, which is randomized point buy,

One person used a method called "stat draft," but I wasn't sure how the numbers were generated for that.

One person used a method called "Holy Grail method," which used playing cards in a method described on an interesting looking graphic.

One person just used playing cards with no redraws or replacement.

One person said that they do 4d6-L, but if the sum of the ability modifiers is under certain numbers, they get a free magic item. Another person said that they do 4d6-L eight times. I don't know if either of them voted "roll" or "other."

You said you used a method of 3d6 for two stats, 4d6-L for two stats, and 5d6-2L for two stats. Which is kind of interesting, I admit. I might propose it to my group.

There were probably a few I missed--there was a lot of argument and debate in that thread--but I think I found most of them.

So, by my reading, there is no "wild card" in that thread that gives a boost to the number of people who roll for stats, whereas there was a small boost to the number of people who use point buy.

Edit: AFAICT, nobody said that they used rolling and/or point buy or stat array.
 

Parmandur

Book-Friend
Yeah. A very large portion of D&D players roll for stats and I don't want to see that go away or rendered an optional rule.
Particularly since they designed a game where it fundamentally doesn't matter.

Casting lots and letting the dice reveal a character is just so much fun for me: I wish more games used more random elements. The Xanathar's Guide lifepath, or the Wildemount Guide Background generator, is pretty awesome and how I like to discover a character.
 


Isn't it already an optional rule?

Hasn't it been an optional rule fore like a decade now?
Akchually, it's the default, with array as an alternative (RAW) and point buy as an optional rule. But, like other optional rules in the PHB, a lot of people use point buy. Possibly a majority, although I can't say I've seen convincing data.

I doubt Maxperson's fears of deleting rolling will come to pass. If you can't roll for stats, is it really Dungeons & Dragons? (No matter how silly an idea it is)
 

Parmandur

Book-Friend
Akchually, it's the default, with array as an alternative (RAW) and point buy as an optional rule. But, like other optional rules in the PHB, a lot of people use point buy. Possibly a majority, although I can't say I've seen convincing data.

I doubt Maxperson's fears of deleting rolling will come to pass. If you can't roll for stats, is it really Dungeons & Dragons? (No matter how silly an idea it is)
It does seem that the variant methods for character generation are more popular than the other variant rules, like Feats, tend to be.
 


Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
So I did indeed decide to go through that thread. Here's what I found:

Seven people said they used standard array, a modified standard array, or gave multiple arrays for the player's to choose from.

Three people said they used either standard array or point buy.

One person said they used the Redrick Roller, which is randomized point buy,

One person used a method called "stat draft," but I wasn't sure how the numbers were generated for that.

One person used a method called "Holy Grail method," which used playing cards in a method described on an interesting looking graphic.

One person just used playing cards with no redraws or replacement.

One person said that they do 4d6-L, but if the sum of the ability modifiers is under certain numbers, they get a free magic item. Another person said that they do 4d6-L eight times. I don't know if either of them voted "roll" or "other."

You said you used a method of 3d6 for two stats, 4d6-L for two stats, and 5d6-2L for two stats. Which is kind of interesting, I admit. I might propose it to my group.

There were probably a few I missed--there was a lot of argument and debate in that thread--but I think I found most of them.

So, by my reading, there is no "wild card" in that thread that gives a boost to the number of people who roll for stats, whereas there was a small boost to the number of people who use point buy.

Edit: AFAICT, nobody said that they used rolling and/or point buy or stat array.
That's 16 out or 27 with at least two being a method of rolling. That's enough to boost the percentage even if it's only two. With only 161 votes those two are more than a full percentage point, and it's probably higher than two.

Give my method a try. It allows players to assign "dump" stats that may or may not be dump, and main stats that may or may not be really high. It's a fun method.
 


Faolyn

(she/her)
That's 16 out or 27 with at least two being a method of rolling. That's enough to boost the percentage even if it's only two. With only 161 votes those two are more than a full percentage point, and it's probably higher than two.

Give my method a try. It allows players to assign "dump" stats that may or may not be dump, and main stats that may or may not be really high. It's a fun method.

Incorrect.

See, that poll indicates who voted for one. So I just double-checked. The two people (other than you) who said that they had different ways of rolling for stats voted "rolling for stats." So you can't double-count their votes. They didn't vote for other and give an alternate dice-rolling method. They voted for rolling and then explained how they roll differently.

Face it, your premise is incorrect. Using the EN Poll, more people voted for point buy than for rolling the dice. Nobody who voted for other gave another die-rolling method, so at most you can count the two people who used playing cards as on the random method side--but even with those two people, rolling is still a minority.

D&DBeyond shows that non-random methods of statgen (point buy and stat array) are more common than random methods like dice.

The occasional discussion on Reddit I've seen also shows that more people prefer non-random methods over random ones.

It's OK if you prefer to roll. My table always rolls for characters, and at least some of then are virulently against point buy. But face facts: large numbers of people disagree with you.

Rolling dice isn't going to go away any time soon. It's up there with races and classes and getting more hit points as you go up in level. So don't worry about it so much.
 


Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
Incorrect.

See, that poll indicates who voted for one. So I just double-checked. The two people (other than you) who said that they had different ways of rolling for stats voted "rolling for stats." So you can't double-count their votes. They didn't vote for other and give an alternate dice-rolling method. They voted for rolling and then explained how they roll differently.

Face it, your premise is incorrect. Using the EN Poll, more people voted for point buy than for rolling the dice. Nobody who voted for other gave another die-rolling method, so at most you can count the two people who used playing cards as on the random method side--but even with those two people, rolling is still a minority.

D&DBeyond shows that non-random methods of statgen (point buy and stat array) are more common than random methods like dice.

The occasional discussion on Reddit I've seen also shows that more people prefer non-random methods over random ones.

It's OK if you prefer to roll. My table always rolls for characters, and at least some of then are virulently against point buy. But face facts: large numbers of people disagree with you.

Rolling dice isn't going to go away any time soon. It's up there with races and classes and getting more hit points as you go up in level. So don't worry about it so much.
So just googled Reddit polls.


The number that rolled is approximately the same as the number that point buy and use arrays combined. We don't know where in the 1.1k to 1.2k that number falls and the number of point buy and array combined is 1.163k. The poll is recent, being only from 8 months ago.

Here's another one from 1 year ago that has rolling just behind the other combined two. 997 to 840.


Those were the only two polls on the first page of Google and I don't feel like digging further. With the margin of error in polling, rolling vs. non-rolling are right about 50/50, which matches up with our site and the margin of error.
 

Faolyn

(she/her)
So just googled Reddit polls.


The number that rolled is approximately the same as the number that point buy and use arrays combined. We don't know where in the 1.1k to 1.2k that number falls and the number of point buy and array combined is 1.163k. The poll is recent, being only from 8 months ago.

Here's another one from 1 year ago that has rolling just behind the other combined two. 997 to 840.


Those were the only two polls on the first page of Google and I don't feel like digging further. With the margin of error in polling, rolling vs. non-rolling are right about 50/50, which matches up with our site and the margin of error.
So I did dig further, and found the opposite.

You can't claim that the numbers are on your side if you're not even bothering to actually look at the numbers.

Especially since, on both of those polls, non-random stat generation beats random stat generation.
 

Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
So I did dig further, and found the opposite.

You can't claim that the numbers are on your side if you're not even bothering to actually look at the numbers.

Especially since, on both of those polls, non-random stat generation beats random stat generation.
Then the numbers are conflicted. Some showing 50/50 and some showing not. Neither can then prove which is true for Reddit. However, if what you and @Ruin Explorer say is true about Reddit and this site leaning more heavily towards point buy and array, then these sites being at near 50/50 with the margin of error means that the D&D players at large are significantly above 50/50 in favor of rolling.

Personally, I don't give any credence to the polls here or any other fan site, or at D&D Beyond which has biased data. They're fun to look at, but that's all.
 

Akchually, it's the default, with array as an alternative (RAW) and point buy as an optional rule. But, like other optional rules in the PHB, a lot of people use point buy. Possibly a majority, although I can't say I've seen convincing data.

I doubt Maxperson's fears of deleting rolling will come to pass. If you can't roll for stats, is it really Dungeons & Dragons? (No matter how silly an idea it is)
I always assumed rolling was designed as a form of verisimilitude. After all, we don't get to decide our stats in real life.
 

Parmandur

Book-Friend
I always assumed rolling was designed as a form of verisimilitude. After all, we don't get to decide our stats in real life.
As an evolution of the RPG format, it makes sense to me that more predictable systems oriented towards "builds" developed. But that always feels so stale to me compared to radically random systems.
 

Faolyn

(she/her)
Then the numbers are conflicted. Some showing 50/50 and some showing not. Neither can then prove which is true for Reddit. However, if what you and @Ruin Explorer say is true about Reddit and this site leaning more heavily towards point buy and array, then these sites being at near 50/50 with the margin of error means that the D&D players at large are significantly above 50/50 in favor of rolling.

Personally, I don't give any credence to the polls here or any other fan site, or at D&D Beyond which has biased data. They're fun to look at, but that's all.
I find it hilarious that you dragged out all of these polls, claiming they supported your claim--but as soon as they're shown to not support you, you say you don't give them any credence. Sour grapes much?

And if you honestly, truly, don't care about these polls, then why on earth are you even trying to claim that most people, or a majority of people, or whatever it is you're claiming? Why not just say "I personally prefer rolling for stats, I will always prefer rolling stats, and I will do this even if some far-off edition of D&D gets rid of it completely." Why try to say that your preferred method is the majority method? Just embrace your reverse-hipsterness and admit you like something after it stopped being cool.
 

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