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5E Nightwalker: Really a CR 20?

Quartz

Explorer
Agreed, but no stun immunity is clearly absent. Makes monks look good ;)
The monk has to get up close and personal and the Nightwalker has +13 to its save vs being stunned.

Also, what is an item "distasteful" to a Nightwalker?
I'm not sure a holy symbol would count in itself, but one that had been previously used to Channel Divinity against it might.

Man, if I ever enforced material components my spellcasters would be screwed!
:)
 

Stalker0

Adventurer
And any GM worth their salt is going to change the monster slightly because those pesky players have read the Monster Manuals. Perhaps the Annihilating Aura is 120' radius with lower damage. Perhaps it recovers HP when Life Eater reduces a target to 0 HP?

Even without altering the monster you could have it use the treasure it carries. Perhaps it has a Ring of Dimension Door or a Crown of Teleportation. So it uses its Finger of Doom ability from 300' then Teleports next to the victim and attacks with two Enervating Focus attacks (and don't forget Annihilating Aura), then Teleports away. Perhaps with the victim. And watch out for one with a Ring of Invisibility!
While very true, I would argue the CR would be adjusted as soon as you change it:)
 

Stalker0

Adventurer
Its interesting to hear how many people keep the monster abilities secret, especially at the higher levels. I'm used to having very knowledge focused players who can whip out DC 26-30 Arcana checks and the like, so they usually "know" the monsters pretty well.
 

ad_hoc

Explorer
Its interesting to hear how many people keep the monster abilities secret, especially at the higher levels. I'm used to having very knowledge focused players who can whip out DC 26-30 Arcana checks and the like, so they usually "know" the monsters pretty well.
Those Intelligence checks are only for recalling information the character already knows.

If the creature is not something that has been written about (and that text is readily available) then there is no roll, the character just fails.
 

Seramus

Explorer
Its interesting to hear how many people keep the monster abilities secret, especially at the higher levels. I'm used to having very knowledge focused players who can whip out DC 26-30 Arcana checks and the like, so they usually "know" the monsters pretty well.
I'm in the same boat. At least one player loves to pump his knowledge skills, and can easily make DC25-30 checks. It's a rare day they don't know something about a monster.
 

Quartz

Explorer
I'm in the same boat. At least one player loves to pump his knowledge skills, and can easily make DC25-30 checks. It's a rare day they don't know something about a monster.
As [MENTION=6748898]ad_hoc[/MENTION] said, if the PC can't have known then the check is going to fail. If you want to give some success produce only the most obvious information. You don't have to read out the MM entry just because the PC made a DC 30 check.
 

CydKnight

Villager
It is easy to come up with ways to beat a Nightwalker in the right setting and circumstances and, with the right party abilities. In what ways could you place a Nightwalker encounter into your campaign that makes it exceedingly more difficult is what I believe is the pertinent question to ask.

I would think about what type of landscape I could place it that would be a hindrance to the party after perhaps just completing a less difficult encounter with either no rest or only a short rest.

I always consider party abilities when choosing an encounter. If a Necromancer were one of the party, I may not consider a Nightwalker encounter for that reason alone. However facing a weakened Necromancer who just fought an encounter may make a Nightwalker a more worthy adversary.

If it still feels squishy, you can always add more. :)
 
And I'm not sure that Banishment will get rid of one permanently. It's not an outsider (fiend, celestial, empyrean, etc); it's undead and released on the Prime when someone enters the Negative.
Banishment doesn't distinguish between 'type'. You don't need the fiend or celestial. It just has to not be 'native' to the prime material for the spell to be permanent (barring loss of concentration, of course).


"If the target is native to a different plane of existence than the one you're on..."
I suppose it's up to the DM if it is native because it's 'born' on the Prime when someone enters the 'negative'....

But my interpretation is that if it is 'released' from the Negative Plane, is then Native to the Negative and therefore an outsider to the Prime Material. I don't have the fluff on the monster itself so I can't really make an accurate assessment.
 

Seramus

Explorer
As [MENTION=6748898]ad_hoc[/MENTION] said, if the PC can't have known then the check is going to fail. If you want to give some success produce only the most obvious information. You don't have to read out the MM entry just because the PC made a DC 30 check.
Ad_Hoc is blocked, so I can't see anything he says. :D

In any case, my PC's engage in Buffy style research where they hit up libraries, consult sages, cast divination spells, cash in favors from other supernatural beings, etc. So under most circumstances they have probably heard of something. And if they have not heard of something, they are more than willing to let people die to avoid rushing while they learn about their enemy. They are a weird bunch.
 

dave2008

Adventurer
Ad_Hoc is blocked, so I can't see anything he says. :D

In any case, my PC's engage in Buffy style research where they hit up libraries, consult sages, cast divination spells, cash in favors from other supernatural beings, etc. So under most circumstances they have probably heard of something. And if they have not heard of something, they are more than willing to let people die to avoid rushing while they learn about their enemy. They are a weird bunch.
If they are doing all of that then they should be able to know its weakness. That is playing (in that style) as intended.
 

Dausuul

Legend
I don't have the fluff on the monster itself so I can't really make an accurate assessment.
The relevant passage: For each creature that enters the plane, a nightwalker is released to take its place. In order for a trapped creature to escape, the released nightwalker must be lured back to the Negative Plane by offerings of life for it to devour.

"Released" and "back" suggest that the nightwalker is indeed native to the Negative Plane.
 
"Released" and "back" suggest that the nightwalker is indeed native to the Negative Plane.
I got a little flexible with that part. I could see it being interpreted as the nightwalker doesn't exist until someone is trapped in the negative energy plane, then they are created on the material plane to keep the balance. I described it as a portal opening the negative energy plane and the victim being sent through, displacing some amount of negative energy which flowed out of the portal into the material plane. Once the portal closed, the pool of dark energy began to take form and a Nightwalker was born.
 

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