D&D (2024) No Dwarf, Halfling, and Orc suborgins, lineages, and legacies

[Minigiant]

The truth is some setting paradigms just wont be commercial successes for actual RPG companies.

The only way you are going to get a setting that cuts "core" classes, races, and their subs is via self fuunding or Kickstarted with money up front,

 

[Mind of tempest]

The truth is some setting paradigms just wont be commercial successes for actual RPG companies.

The only way you are going to get a setting that cuts "core" classes, races, and their subs is via self fuunding or Kickstarted with money up front,

cuts some expand on others seems saner, hard to do more dwarves or halflings shuffle them of to the side as bit parts for one, the nebulous cannon.
focus on some of the up-and-comers like goliath and Dragonborn add in something to sell people on it like explanations on doing an adventure type or a class or some other alteration to just going on quests like domain level play and I am fairly certain it will sell.
people mostly play homebrew and thus buy slightly differently meaning think as if it can be cut up and added to other things if desired and you have a viable product.

 

[Minigiant]

cuts some expand on others seems saner, hard to do more dwarves or halflings shuffle them of to the side as bit parts for one, the nebulous cannon.
focus on some of the up-and-comers like goliath and Dragonborn add in something to sell people on it like explanations on doing an adventure type or a class or some other alteration to just going on quests like domain level play and I am fairly certain it will sell.
people mostly play homebrew and thus buy slightly differently meaning think as if it can be cut up and added to other things if desired and you have a viable product.

8/10 the cutters don't want to replace the cuttees with new stuff.

 

[Remathilis]

The truth is some setting paradigms just wont be commercial successes for actual RPG companies.

The only way you are going to get a setting that cuts "core" classes, races, and their subs is via self fuunding or Kickstarted with money up front,

Even then, how many successful Kickstarter projects are there that are D&D adjacent and don't end up using the vast majority of D&D's classes and races? Ignoring those who are clearly using specific IP (such a One Ring) or not using a 5e based engine, most of the 5e projects and settings still end up with all 12 of the 5e classes as options.

I will admit I don't follow the 3pp Kickstarter scene all that much, so if anyone knows of a popular 3pp setting for D&D that doesn't use the PHB classes, id be interested to hear about it.

(I'm using classes here as races seem to be trivial to replace. But really, I'm using them as short hand for basically using much of the PHB material with a few twists or flourishes rather than making a bunch of new character options to replace the PHB with).

 

[Micah Sweet]

See for me 1997 was when I first started gaming, and from what I can remember (I was 11yo then) it was great and terrible. I loved 2e, from tabletop to BG1+2, it was never really "worn out" for me- we just moved on to what our Forever-DM was running, which when 3e came out was of course 3e.

I'd never want to go back to 3e. I would, and have once or twice dipped my toe back into, 2e again. Not to say 3e was terrible, it was the best D&D to us when it was the current edition.
But I am very much over all that hyper-simulationist crunch.

But there's that saying "you can never go home again." And it's probably accurate... running/playing 2e now wouldn't be the same as it was back then.

I was 21. It really was peak gaming content at the time for me. So much amazing stuff from a wide variety of games. I was playing 1e/2e, L5R, Deadlands, Cyberpunk 2020, Call of Cthulhu. Dragon Magazine was chugging along. Went to conventions with my old group every year or so...

 

[Micah Sweet]

I sometimes do too. But that's because of White Wolf's World of Darkness games, I do not miss AD&D one bit.

Never got into those. Had a friend who used them to meet women.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Even then, how many successful Kickstarter projects are there that are D&D adjacent and don't end up using the vast majority of D&D's classes and races? Ignoring those who are clearly using specific IP (such a One Ring) or not using a 5e based engine, most of the 5e projects and settings still end up with all 12 of the 5e classes as options.

I will admit I don't follow the 3pp Kickstarter scene all that much, so if anyone knows of a popular 3pp setting for D&D that doesn't use the PHB classes, id be interested to hear about it.

(I'm using classes here as races seem to be trivial to replace. But really, I'm using them as short hand for basically using much of the PHB material with a few twists or flourishes rather than making a bunch of new character options to replace the PHB with).

Level Up replaced the PHB.

 

[Remathilis]

Level Up replaced the PHB.

But Level Up still has a barbarian, bard, cleric, druid, etc. They still use familiar 5e tropes like rage, wild shape, etc. it replaces and enhances the mechanics of each part, but if maintains those elements in the game.

Show me a setting that doesn't. One that doesn't have paladins and sorcerers. One who radically redefines the classes so that bards don't cast spells or druids don't wild shape. Because I cannot think of a setting or game that doesn't, beyond licensed ones like The One Ring or Doctors and Daleks.

 

[Distracted DM]

But Level Up still has a barbarian, bard, cleric, druid, etc. They still use familiar 5e tropes like rage, wild shape, etc. it replaces and enhances the mechanics of each part, but if maintains those elements in the game.

Show me a setting that doesn't. One that doesn't have paladins and sorcerers. One who radically redefines the classes so that bards don't cast spells or druids don't wild shape. Because I cannot think of a setting or game that doesn't, beyond licensed ones like The One Ring or Doctors and Daleks.

Ok I think I lost the point here somewhere along the way, please restate the point/request unless I have it right below:

Are you saying that you can't have a successful 5e game that doesn't have all the core 5e classes, and that's why you couldn't do a modern Dark Sun because you'd have to cut out a lot of the core 5e classes and fantasy tropes, rather than "here are ways that you can fit everything in the phb into this setting, even though it really shouldn't belong?"

Because I think that I might know of a couple different Kickstarters that did this, to different degrees, but I want to make sure I'm understanding the point first

 

[Micah Sweet]

But Level Up still has a barbarian, bard, cleric, druid, etc. They still use familiar 5e tropes like rage, wild shape, etc. it replaces and enhances the mechanics of each part, but if maintains those elements in the game.

Show me a setting that doesn't. One that doesn't have paladins and sorcerers. One who radically redefines the classes so that bards don't cast spells or druids don't wild shape. Because I cannot think of a setting or game that doesn't, beyond licensed ones like The One Ring or Doctors and Daleks.

The upcoming Voidrunner's Codex for Level Up.