Not a Conspiracy Theory: Moving Toward Better Criticism in RPGs

[FrogReaver]

Map and Key is not meant to be a criticism of mainstream play. It is meant to be a description comparing it to just in time scenario design built to address thematic / dramatic needs.

I read it as a criticism related to guessing where things are. It certainly not the way players of D&D would ever choose to describe their own game.

I guess blame @pemterton if i read more into it than is intended

 

[hawkeyefan]

I read it as a criticism related to guessing where things are. It certainly not the way players of D&D would ever choose to describe their own game.

I guess blame @pemterton if i read more into it than is intended

I think this is a core of the issue, honestly. The description is accurate… it cuts out the “Magic of Roleplaying” (TM) and describes what’s happening plainly. And that simplicity can be eye-opening. It can be surprising. It can be uncomfortable. All the things that @innerdude posted about a few pages ago in an excellent post.

And a lot of people don’t like that. They need to think that more is happening in play than the players declaring moves, and the GM consulting the map & key/ his prep to determine what happens. Even though that’s clearly what is happening in play.

 

[Manbearcat]

Sure, but it's apparently being applied to all gaming of a certain style, module or not.

I know you are trying to be helpful but I really don't think this is the part he doesn't get about it.

What is the part that you're not getting Micah? "Map and key" is the approach of "classic crawling" but it extends to a lot of variations of play beyond that approach, or pawn stance dungeon crawls, or sandbox w/ metaplot, etc (Torchbearer features it and I mentioned upthread that I've used Map and key procedures, 3 variations actually, for some Blades in the Dark Transport Scores). I think what @pemerton might have been getting at is "map and key and/or GM prepped play space is not exhaustive" (in terms of types of play) and that was his critique of the taxonomy being put forth.

EDIT - Dogs in the Vineyard Town creation is (Relationship) Map & Key prep. You create 6(ish) NPCs with dramatic needs and problems that sow conflict within the basic premise of play, provoking some kind of reaction/intervention/judgement.

 

[FrogReaver]

I think this is a core of the issue, honestly. The description is accurate… it cuts out the “Magic of Roleplaying” (TM) and describes what’s happening plainly. And that simplicity can be eye-opening. It can be surprising. It can be uncomfortable. All the things that @innerdude posted about a few pages ago.

Or the alternative take - it's an attempt to strip out anything good about D&D - like most other terminology used in these discussions.

*I'll note the terms used for the games you prefer don't have this same kind of effect - only the terms used relative to D&D style play.

 

[hawkeyefan]

Or the alternative take - it's an attempt to strip out anything good about D&D - like most other terminology used in these discussions.

*I'll note the terms used for the games you prefer don't have this same kind of effect - only the terms used relative to D&D style play.

How does it strip anything away?

Does hexcrawl strip anything away? They’re similarly simple.

What effect does this term have? What does “map and key” take away?

And I love D&D. LOVE IT. I play it weekly with my best friends who I made at a very young age and who I bonded with over… D&D.

So no, I don’t dislike D&D. I’m just able to examine play and honestly say what’s happening.

 

[FrogReaver]

If this is true, then analysis of games is legitimately impossible. It would be like two different audiences changing whether a film is a documentary or a comedy.

I think there will be some patterns and key takeaways once the research is done, but i don't think we are anywhere near the research required to get remotely close to solid analysis. All we have are the beginnings of theories and at some point the research actually needs done to determine whether a theory actually has merits.

 

[niklinna]

Comparing D&D and PbtA is like comparing a GSX-R750 to a Civic, both great at what they do, and both will get you there, except totally different, and with a totally different appeal to different people.

Ah but which is which!

(That was a joke and I do not assume you actually meant there is a mapping between the two pairs.)

 

[FrogReaver]

So no, I don’t dislike D&D. I’m just able to examine play and honestly say what’s happening.

So I'm not able to examine play honestly?

 

[FrogReaver]

To elaborate-

Does hexcrawl strip anything away? They’re similarly simple.

Nope, hexcrawl is also a term those that enjoy that style use to describe their own games.

What effect does this term have? What does “map and key” take away?

In the best case it's leaving out important details, in the worst its a lie by omission.

 

[hawkeyefan]

So I'm not able to examine play honestly?

I don't know.

Explain to me your dislike of the use of the phrase “map and key” to describe GM-prep focused play.

You said it “has an effect” and “takes away what’s good” about the game. How so? What is the effect? What is lost?