"Noticing" invisible creatures

[NPC]

Let's say your character has made permanent See Invisibility.

He is on a crowded street, with throngs of people going about their daily business.

30 feet away, a wizard, who has cast Invisibility on himself, rounds the corner of a building and enters into the cone of your character's See Invisibility spell.

I have a couple of questions:

1. Does your character know that the wizard is invisible?

2. If the answer to #1 is "yes", *how* does your character know that the wizard is invisible?

3. If the answer to your question is "no", does your character get to determine if the wizard is invisible? If so, how?

I've looked over Invisibility and See Invisibility and I can't find definitive answers to these questions.

I realize this view isn't supported by the rules, but I'm leaning towards the interpretation that--to a character with See Invisibility cast on them--an invisible creature looks "different" somehow compared to a visible creature.

Otherwise, it would seem that some kind of Spot check is in order for a See Invisibilitied character to notice that a creature is invisible. This might lead to an added level of complication that I'm not sure I want to deal with as a DM

Anyway, I'd appreciate hearing some other opinions.

Thanks.

 

[Camarath]

I think the "as if they were normally visible." quote form See Invisiblity seem to indicate the caster would see invisible objects and creature as if they were normaly visible can could tell form sight that they were invisible. The caster might be able to tell if he used detect magic or had a way of supressing the spell. One could always ask someone else or if a psion look through you psycrystal. Or the DM could rule that invisible things look off or funny in some way.

 

[JChung2003]

1. No. "You see any objects or beings that are invisible as well as any that are astral or ethereal, as if they were normally visible."

3. If he is trained in the Spellcraft skill, he could attempt a Spellcraft check of DC 22 (PHB pg. 74, DC 20 + spell level) to identify a spell (invisibility) that is already in place and in effect (no retry).

He could cast detect magic and attempt a Spellcraft check of DC 17 to identify the school of magic involved in the magical aura (DC 15 + spell level). He wouldn't know that the wizard was invisible, but he would know that the wizard was using some sort of illusion to disguise himself.

The easiest way would be to point the wizard out to a friend of his who can't see invisible and ask him what they see. That, however, is the subject of an enormous debate on rec.games.frp.dnd at the moment so that might open up a whole new can of worms for you.

 

[NPC]

Thanks for the replies. You two have summed up our debate in two posts. Some think that there's something "different" about invisible creatures while others think that you have to spend extra actions performing "Spot" type checks to figure out if you're seeing an invisible creature.

 

[rhammer2]

There is a simpler method, the See Invisible spell is a cone. That means your peripheral vision is not covered, so assuming someone is looking around, the invisible person would be popping in and out of sight.

Thanks for the replies. You two have summed up our debate in two posts. Some think that there's something "different" about invisible creatures while others think that you have to spend extra actions performing "Spot" type checks to figure out if you're seeing an invisible creature.

 

[Camarath]

Hahaha! No fair you can't just read the spell and find the easy answer just like that. What if your blind what do you see then?

 

[alaric]

In my campaign I've tried to neuter Invisibility a bit, without changing the spell much. So for me, See Invis causes invisible creatures to glow with a lighted aura around them, basically making them quite obviously invisible and easily detectable.

 

[Demise]

What if your blind what do you see then?

Um, nothing. What is the point to this question?

 

[Camarath]

Sarcasm and the wording of the spell says "You see any objects or being that are invisible, as well as any that are astral or ethereal, as if they were normally visible." which one could if one wanted interpret as saying under the effects of the spell any creature can see invisible creature or objects raguardless of normal visual ability. It is also a joke mocking me for not reading the entire spell and realising that it effect is a cone thus it can move back and forth solving the problem we were having with ""Noticing" invisible creatures".

Sorry about any confusion I caused.