D&D 4E Obligatory dump stats in 4e: the irrelevance of Intelligence

[hong]

Not really. Skill points help I suppose, but I was aiming more for the concept of a daring outlaw or a vigilante that is supposed to use their brains as often as their agile fighting skills, but not so much their strength of muscle.

Play a warlord.

 

[Felon]

In the grand history of D&D, 3e was an anomaly in this respect.

It was the first edition where Rogues/Thieves/whatever needed a high Intelligence in order to get the most use out of their thieving skills. Intelligence was an easy dump stat for Thieves in 2e.

I see this as more of a "going back to the roots" as opposed to "destroying 3e's archetypes."

If you made an improvenment on something, then "going back to your roots" is just a plattiude for downgrading. The roots we're talking about involved rolling a bunch of dice and hoping you got one or two decent rolls, and the rest could be 5's for all it mattered. Getting some general utility boost from INT was a real crowd-pleaser. It feels rather sloppy for them to flush general utility out of it now.

 

[Scholar & Brutalman]

You could also go Int 13, and take Jack of All Trades.

Are there any other general purpose feats that have an Int prerequisite?

 

[Mal Malenkirk]

Guys, the smartest, most clever character is almost always that of the smartest, most clever player.

A smart player can deliberately play dumb if it amuses him (I sometime deliebrately blunder for the sake of comedy), but a dumb player can't play a smart PC.

That's why my low to average intelligence fighter often has better tactics to offer than the 20 Int wizard. And I won't apologize for that!

Mechanically, inteliigence represent academic knowledge for the most part, memory also. In the case of a wizard, he demonstrate an impressive ability to memorize a considerable amount of data and recall it readily even under pressure.

But logic, common sense, the tactical ability to think a few step ahead? You have it or you don't. Stop looking at your stat sheet.

 

[Felon]

You could also make both stats apply to defenses instead of just the highest one, would that make sense?

Well, whatever benefit Int could be house-ruled to provide, it shouldn't require any reworkign of creatures that appear in the MM or adventures.

I think they could've tied the skill training feat into Intelligence. Either setting a minimum INT to take it, or using the modifier to limit the number of times it could be taken.

Or perhaps allow a positive Int modifier to add class an equivalent number of skills to your class skill list?

 

[Incenjucar]

People need to keep in mind that someone with Int 12 is probably already smart enough that that the average commoner is frustrating to talk with for more than a few minutes.

 

[hong]

If you made an improvenment on something, then "going back to your roots" is just a plattiude for downgrading. The roots we're talking about involved rolling a bunch of dice and hoping you got one or two decent rolls, and the rest could be 5's for all it mattered. Getting some general utility boost from INT was a real crowd-pleaser. It feels rather sloppy for them to flush general utility out of it now.

I'm not aware of getting a boost from Int being a "real crowd-pleaser". So far, I see maybe half a dozen people yowling about it being taken away.

You can still play a smart guy in 4E. You _have_ to play a smart guy to take best advantage of certain classes (wiz, warlord). You may not be playing the exact same smart guys in 4E as in 3E, but that's by the by.

 

[Felon]

Are there any other general purpose feats that have an Int prerequisite?

Yes. One other. Hold on to your seat....

Linguist!

Now go get your socks from wherever they were blown off too.

I tell ya, the designers didn't make an oversight here. This was something they thought out.

 

[Scholar & Brutalman]

Yes. One other. Hold on to your seat....

Linguist!

Is there any way to learn more than your beginning languages other than Linguist?

 

[The Little Raven]

Is there any way to learn more than your beginning languages other than Linguist?

No. But Linguist does give you three languages.