OK we know the Sorcerer is Broken, How would you fix him

[Smokingmonkee]

Variant I play with + some help from enworlders

While at work I tweaked the Sorcerer my group plays with by adding the extra slot and the sudden metamagic so lemme know what ya'all think

Variant Sorcerer
Alignment: Any.
Hit Die: d6.

Class Skills
The sorcerer’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Knowledge (arcana) (Int), Profession (Wis), Spellcraft (Int), and Use Magic Device (Cha).
Skill Points at 1st Level: (4 + Int modifier) x 4.
Skill Points at Each Additional Level: 4 + Int modifier.

Table: The Sorcerer
——––———————Spells per Day—————————
Level Base Attack Bonus Fort Save Ref Save Will Save Special 0 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th 6th 7th 8th 9th
1st +0 +0 +0 +2 Summon FamiliarEschew Material Components 5 3 — — — — — — — —
2nd +1 +0 +0 +3 6 4 — — — — — — — —
3rd +1 +1 +1 +3 6 5 0 — — — — — — —
4th +2 +1 +1 +4 6 6 3 — — — — — — —
5th +2 +1 +1 +4 Sudden Metamagic 6 6 4 0 — — — — — —
6th +3 +2 +2 +5 6 6 5 3 — — — — — —
7th +3 +2 +2 +5 6 6 6 4 0 — — — — —
8th +4 +2 +2 +6 6 6 6 5 3 — — — — —
9th +4 +3 +3 +6 6 6 6 6 4 0 — — — —
10th +5 +3 +3 +7 Sudden Metamagic 6 6 6 6 5 3 — — — —
11th +5 +3 +3 +7 6 6 6 6 6 4 0 — — —
12th +6/+1 +4 +4 +8 6 6 6 6 6 5 3 — — —
13th +6/+1 +4 +4 +8 6 6 6 6 6 6 4 0 — —
14th +7/+2 +4 +4 +9 6 6 6 6 6 6 5 3 — —
15th +7/+2 +5 +5 +9 Sudden Metamagic 6 6 6 6 6 6 6 4 0 —
16th +8/+3 +5 +5 +10 6 6 6 6 6 6 6 5 3 —
17th +8/+3 +5 +5 +10 6 6 6 6 6 6 6 6 4 0
18th +9/+4 +6 +6 +11 6 6 6 6 6 6 6 6 5 3
19th +9/+4 +6 +6 +11 6 6 6 6 6 6 6 6 6 4
20th +10/+5 +6 +6 +12 Sudden Metamagic 6 6 6 6 6 6 6 6 6 6

Table: Sorcerer Spells Known
———————— Spells Known —–———————
Level 0 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th 6th 7th 8th 9th
1st 4 2 — — — — — — — —
2nd 5 2 — — — — — — — —
3rd 5 3 — — — — — — — —
4th 6 3 1 — — — — — — —
5th 6 4 2 — — — — — — —
6th 7 4 2 1 — — — — — —
7th 7 5 3 2 — — — — — —
8th 8 5 3 2 1 — — — — —
9th 8 5 4 3 2 — — — — —
10th 9 5 4 3 2 1 — — — —
11th 9 5 5 4 3 2 — — — —
12th 9 5 5 4 3 2 1 — — —
13th 9 5 5 4 4 3 2 — — —
14th 9 5 5 4 4 3 2 1 — —
15th 9 5 5 4 4 4 3 2 — —
16th 9 5 5 4 4 4 3 2 1 —
17th 9 5 5 4 4 4 3 3 2 —
18th 9 5 5 4 4 4 3 3 2 1
19th 9 5 5 4 4 4 3 3 3 2
20th 9 5 5 4 4 4 3 3 3 3

Class Features
All of the following are class features of the sorcerer.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Sorcerers are proficient with all simple weapons. They are not proficient with any type of armor or shield. Armor of any type interferes with a sorcerer’s gestures, which can cause his spells with somatic components to fail.
Spells: A sorcerer casts arcane spells which are drawn primarily from the sorcerer/wizard spell list. He can cast any spell he knows without preparing it ahead of time, the way a wizard or a cleric must (see below).
To learn or cast a spell, a sorcerer must have a Charisma score equal to at least 10 + the spell level. The Difficulty Class for a saving throw against a sorcerer’s spell is 10 + the spell level + the sorcerer’s Charisma modifier.
Like other spellcasters, a sorcerer can cast only a certain number of spells of each spell level per day. His base daily spell allotment is given on Table: The Sorcerer. In addition, he receives bonus spells per day if he has a high Charisma score.
A sorcerer’s selection of spells is extremely limited. A sorcerer begins play knowing four 0-level spells and two 1st-level spells of your choice. At each new sorcerer level, he gains one or more new spells, as indicated on Table: Sorcerer Spells Known. (Unlike spells per day, the number of spells a sorcerer knows is not affected by his Charisma score; the numbers on Table: Sorcerer Spells Known are fixed.) These new spells can be common spells chosen from the sorcerer/wizard spell list, or they can be unusual spells that the sorcerer has gained some understanding of by study. The sorcerer can’t use this method of spell acquisition to learn spells at a faster rate, however.
Upon reaching 4th level, and at every even-numbered sorcerer level after that (6th, 8th, and so on), a sorcerer can choose to learn a new spell in place of one he already knows. In effect, the sorcerer “loses” the old spell in exchange for the new one. The new spell’s level must be the same as that of the spell being exchanged, and it must be at least two levels lower than the highest-level sorcerer spell the sorcerer can cast. A sorcerer may swap only a single spell at any given level, and must choose whether or not to swap the spell at the same time that he gains new spells known for the level.
Unlike a wizard or a cleric, a sorcerer need not prepare his spells in advance. He can cast any spell he knows at any time, assuming he has not yet used up his spells per day for that spell level. He does not have to decide ahead of time which spells he’ll cast.
Familiar: A sorcerer can obtain a familiar (see below). Doing so takes 24 hours and uses up magical materials that cost 100 gp. A familiar is a magical beast that resembles a small animal and is unusually tough and intelligent. The creature serves as a companion and servant.
The sorcerer chooses the kind of familiar he gets. As the sorcerer advances in level, his familiar also increases in power.
If the familiar dies or is dismissed by the sorcerer, the sorcerer must attempt a DC 15 Fortitude saving throw. Failure means he loses 200 experience points per sorcerer level; success reduces the loss to one-half that amount. However, a sorcerer’s experience point total can never go below 0 as the result of a familiar’s demise or dismissal. A slain or dismissed familiar cannot be replaced for a year and day. A slain familiar can be raised from the dead just as a character can be, and it does not lose a level or a Constitution point when this happy event occurs.
A character with more than one class that grants a familiar may have only one familiar at a time.
Eschew Material Components: At first level a sorcerer receives Eschew Material Components as a bonus feat.
Sudden Metamagic: At levels 5, 10, 15, 20 a sorcerer receives a Sudden Metamagic feat of her choice as a bonus feat.



I’d like to credit apsuman and Sejs for giving me ideas to finish this off.

 

[Darklone]

Met a sorcerer in a PBeM who had Toughness and Martial Weapon Prof Greataxe at level 1... high Str, high Con, high Cha... 11 hitpoints at level 1, good armour due to shield spell. But he was stuppppid and slooooow.

 

[Shadowdweller]

I, too, strongly disagree that the sorcerer is especially underpowered. If I were to tweak anything, it would be to grant arcane spell preparation automatically if desired...thus allowing the use of quickened spells and the means to cast somatic spells while grappled. And maybe grant Use Magic Device as a class skill (as one of the 3.5 game designers suggested IIRC).

The truth is that sorcerers learn plenty of spells. People always make a big deal about the wizard's ability to learn a huge repertoire, but the fact is that any given problem, combat and challenge-wise, may be solved by a variety of different means. Given a decent spell selection, there shouldn't be any problems.

 

[Khaalis]

The truth is that sorcerers learn plenty of spells. People always make a big deal about the wizard's ability to learn a huge repertoire, but the fact is that any given problem, combat and challenge-wise, may be solved by a variety of different means. Given a decent spell selection, there shouldn't be any problems.

The only problem that I personally have with this theory is that this line of thought results in the need for threads like this:
http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=183763

Thus locking any sorcerer who wants to be "worth their weight" to HAVE to have a spell list that is 90% the same as everyone else. There are only a very small sway of variability in a sorcerers spell choices to make them a "Decent Spell Selection." It doesnt allow for creativity, themes based on background etc. As far as its concerned you might as well take out the 'Spells Known' table and dictate what spells all sorceres gain instead.

I have run in and run many games with sorcerers. They lack in Many ways compared to other classes. The other problem is the core system in designed for classic a party of 4... a Fighter, Cleric, Wizard and Rogue. The sorcerer Cannot, as currently written, make a fair and viable substitute to the Wizard in that equation. The only time the core Sorcerer makes a "balanced" addition to the party is if they are nothing more than creme added on Top of the 4 core party classes.

The sorcerer's lack of versatility and lack of uniqueness are its downfall. When even compared to other classes than Wizard, for example the Psionic classes, the sorcerer falls even farther behind on the balance/usefulness/creativity curve, and has nothing to really differentiate it as its own class concept, being nothing more than a variant wizard (and a poorly done one IMHO).

I personally Love the concept of the Sorcerer, but I seriously think that the designers fell flat on their face with its implementation. It feels like it was rushed and slapped together for no other reason than they felt that the Arcane Caster archetype NEEDED a second option to Wizard to balance with all of the other archetype roles that have at least 2 path choices. The sorcerer is nothing more than a pale shadow of the wizard as it currently exists.

JMHO. YMMV.

 

[Shadowdweller]

Thus locking any sorcerer who wants to be "worth their weight" to HAVE to have a spell list that is 90% the same as everyone else.

Ironic then that the thread you've just linked to lists a NUMBER of DIFFERENT, (supposedly anyway) viable sorcerer spell lists.

The sorcerer's lack of versatility and lack of uniqueness are its downfall. When even compared to other classes than Wizard, for example the Psionic classes,

And I've played my fair share of games with both sorcerers and psions. Given the Psion's tiny power list, they make the sorcerer look like a roleplayer's wet dream in terms of spell/power/theme diversity, specialization-specifics aside.

 

[ThirdWizard]

To me the summoning of a familar is far more appropriate to a Wizard, who learns and casts spells through trainign and ritual. I could never figure out a reason for a Sorcerer to suddenly bond to some animal. Whereas the familiar bonding process seems a natural thing for a wizard to study.

Am I missing something?

(maybe I should start a new thread about this over in General...)

I always thought of familiars more as lab helpers, which fits a wizard more. It's all up to personal interprietation and what literature one has read I suppose.

I know a really good book but I forgot the name (somthing like Jihreg, someone will probably know what I'm talking about) in which the familiar helped ease the stress of rituals of the spellcaster. I really liked this idea of a familiar.

 

[Thanee]

I think the familiar fits to both, sorcerer and wizard. To the wizard as a kind of helper and to the sorcerer as a sort of mythical companion.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Storminator]

I have run in and run many games with sorcerers. They lack in Many ways compared to other classes. The other problem is the core system in designed for classic a party of 4... a Fighter, Cleric, Wizard and Rogue. The sorcerer Cannot, as currently written, make a fair and viable substitute to the Wizard in that equation. The only time the core Sorcerer makes a "balanced" addition to the party is if they are nothing more than creme added on Top of the 4 core party classes.

I'm running a game with a sorcerer, and even tho he's Drow (with a +2ECL), he's been hugely effective. The sheer weight of firepower he can throw is enormous.

Recently, thru a series of encounters without rest, he used all but 2 0-level spells. At 12th level, that's a lot of spells. I have never, in 24 years of play, seen a high level wizard make use of every single spell slot. There's always a dead slot somewhere.

I think sorcerers are fine.

PS

 

[Gez]

My solution was to remove one spell/day for each spell level, and to compensate with nifty special abilities. See the epigone sorcerer variant.

 

[Gez]

I think the familiar fits to both, sorcerer and wizard. To the wizard as a kind of helper and to the sorcerer as a sort of mythical companion.

That's why in my alt. sorcerer, the character gets an improved spell list when he binds himself to a familiar adapted to his bloodline.