OK we know the Sorcerer is Broken, How would you fix him

[dead]

Give the Sorcerer its own *unique* spell list.

I always found it funny that they replicate all the "manufactured" spells of wizards. Surely they've got a whole bunch that emphasise raw magical, creative power. Not Bigby's Hand or Melf's Acid arrow.

 

[satori01]

I've toyed with the notion of allowing a Sorc to chose any spell of an appropriate level, including divine spells.

 

[Gez]

Give the Sorcerer its own *unique* spell list.

I always found it funny that they replicate all the "manufactured" spells of wizards. Surely they've got a whole bunch that emphasise raw magical, creative power. Not Bigby's Hand or Melf's Acid arrow.

That's a solution I don't like, because I loath the proliferation of spell lists. It's bothersome to have a separate spell list for the wizard, the sorcerer, the wu-jen, the warmage, and whatever other Primary Arcane Spellcaster class you may find.

Why couldn't they replicate manufactured spells? Sorcerers are "magic incarnate," they can replicate any arcane spell!

 

[apsuman]

Give the Sorcerer its own *unique* spell list.

I always found it funny that they replicate all the "manufactured" spells of wizards. Surely they've got a whole bunch that emphasise raw magical, creative power. Not Bigby's Hand or Melf's Acid arrow.

That's because you are looking at it wrong...

The sorcerer's spells are "raw magical, creative power." See, it's the wizard that's copying the sorcerer's raw spells, Bigby's, Tasha's, and Melf's being the exception.

 

[Henry]

Wouldn't this be more "house rules" territory?

My thought for about two years now has been to:

Step 1: Take metamagic feats out of the bonus feats available to Wizards - if a wizard wants to fold, spindle, and mutilate his magic he can figure out how to do that in his off-time; wizards are more "mechanics" than "artists."

Step 2: Give the Sorcerer Heighten Spell (or Eschew AND Heighten) for free at first level, and give them a free metamagic feat every five levels. Sorcerers aren't mechanics, they're artists - if they want to figure out how to make magic items let 'em do it in their off-time.

 

[Grayhawk]

I know a really good book but I forgot the name (somthing like Jihreg, someone will probably know what I'm talking about) in which the familiar helped ease the stress of rituals of the spellcaster.

That was Jhereg by Steven Brust, named after the race of the main character's familar (kind of a sarcastic, cynical Pseudo Dragon).

AFAIR, there was both sorcerous and wizard magic in that world, and the assassin Vlad used wizard magic to cast teleport spells but sorcerous magic to cast the 'Find Familiar'-like spell.

 

[jarlaxlecq]

I think that just having the metamagic feats goes a long way towards balancing the wizard and sorcerer. On of the major pitfalls that comes with being a sorcerer is simply the lack of spells but with the right metamagic feats will enable lower level spells to be as powerful as higher levels without needing to get those spells. Between that and having access to higher spells at the same pace as wizards even if socerers techincally donr have those level spells YET reinforce the notion that sorcerers are using their existing spells in differant ways to make up for the lack of spells.
I say the bonus metamagic feats make more sense for the sorerer then they do for the wizards. l like the options the specialist wizards get in uneathed arcana better for wizards.

So when i show my DM this is what my varient would get


D4
Enshew Magic components
Spell level prgression like a wizard, just no known spells of that level till a sorcerer would normally be able to use them
bonus metamagic feats like a wizard.

 

[apsuman]

I think that just having the metamagic feats goes a long way towards balancing the wizard and sorcerer. On of the major pitfalls that comes with being a sorcerer is simply the lack of spells but with the right metamagic feats will enable lower level spells to be as powerful as higher levels without needing to get those spells. Between that and having access to higher spells at the same pace as wizards even if socerers techincally donr have those level spells YET reinforce the notion that sorcerers are using their existing spells in differant ways to make up for the lack of spells.
I say the bonus metamagic feats make more sense for the sorerer then they do for the wizards. l like the options the specialist wizards get in uneathed arcana better for wizards.

So when i show my DM this is what my varient would get


D4
Enshew Magic components
Spell level prgression like a wizard, just no known spells of that level till a sorcerer would normally be able to use them
bonus metamagic feats like a wizard.

yes, perhaps, Eschew Materials OR Arcane Preparation at first level (think of it as the equivalent of Scribe Scroll)

Don't forget to point out that high ability scores would give you extra bonus slots even though you would still know no spells of that highest level. In other words, if you had a high CHA you might have bonus second level slots (or third or fourth, etc.) even though you do not know any of that spell level yet. This might make the sorcerer class too powerful to some people.

Also, if a sorcerer were to ever take an item creation feat, like create wands, and if he knows fireball he could, with this variant in place, IIRC, make a wand of fireballs for fifth caster level that does 5d6. Currently, IIRC, he would only be able to make 6d6 or higher wands of fireball.

 

[Darren Ravenshaw]

Personally one of the problems I have with the Sorcerer is that a
20th level Sorcerer can know 4-3rd, 4-4th, 4-5th, and 3-6th level spells. A 20th level Bard on the other hand can know
5-3rd, 5-4th, 5-5th, and 4-6th level spells. One more of each level. How is it that a Bard; who is a secondary caster can know more spells of those levels than a Sorcerer; who is a primary caster.

 

[Khaalis]

Personally one of the problems I have with the Sorcerer is that a
20th level Sorcerer can know 4-3rd, 4-4th, 4-5th, and 3-6th level spells. A 20th level Bard on the other hand can know
5-3rd, 5-4th, 5-5th, and 4-6th level spells. One more of each level. How is it that a Bard; who is a secondary caster can know more spells of those levels than a Sorcerer; who is a primary caster.

"Suposedly" because it is balanced by the fact the Sorcerer also knows 7th, 8th and 9th level spells that the Bard does not.