Older Members of the Board help me !

[Rashak Mani]

** QUEM FOR JOGAR DESAFIO DRAGAO PARA DE LER AGORA **

Jose Guilherme (warning for my players)



Caliban and Co.


I know these threads came and went but now I need to know this stuff with a certain degree of knowledge/justification.

Remember the Vorpal Keen Sword Discussion ? Many ideias went around... was there a consensus rules wise ? Balance wise ? Is there a +5 wpn bonus limit really ? Give me arguments to stop players from creating these weapons.

( Is there such a thing as well a Vorpal Dancing Blade ?)

Prismatic Sphere and Wall things... can someone teleport inside ? Spell description seems more to stop Shotting running inside than teleporting. Ethereal creatures would take damage the way I see it... but not Teleporters perhaps.

If I run thru a Prismatic sphere/wall spell... do I suffer all the effects in order in that ROUND or do I take one effect for every round. Does Prismatic delay you a round per effect or not if you dont care about getting zapped by them all ?


Thanks for these hairy questions....

 

[gfunk]

About the Vorpal/Keen stuff:

It's my understanding that +5 is the maximum enhancement bonus that you can give a weapon and +10 is the maximum enhancement equivalent. Anything beyond +10 would make the weapon at least a minor artifact.

<edit>
Oh , I realized that you wanted some arguments as well. Look at the weapons that exceed the "+10 limits" in the core rules. Typical examples are theVorpal, Dancing Greatsword of a Solar (the greatest of celestials) and the Sword of Kas (major artifact). In both cases it's easy to see that if you are running around with such powerful weapons you will attract the attention of very powerful Outsiders. For instance, slaying a Solar and taking its sword is an act just begging to get you annihlated by Celestials. In the upcoming Epic Level rules I'm sure there will be provisions for making such weapons but in the meantime the parameters are in your hands. If your players really want to make one, put them through very epic quests to get components (e.g. a drop of blood from Orcus, a scale from Bahamut) to construct such a powerful item.

For the Prismatic stuff:

It really depends how you interpret several things. First, I beleive that Teleportation is considered instantaneous Astral travel. So, I assume, you enter the Astral plane immediately then are transported ln a line to the point you wish to arrive at. The 6th level of the Wall/Sphere (Indigo) "stops all spells." In the case of a Pris Sphere, you are surrounded on all sides so I would rule that a teleporting opponent is stopped by the Sphere and suffers all the effects. A Wall is more hairy because, IMO, you have to teleport "through" it and your trajectory depends on your starting and end points.

Any creature stupid (or powerful) enough to pass through the Prismatic Sphere/Wall is affected by all the damaging effects simultaneously but in the order that they are listed. For instance if a creature is turned to stone, then he is not subject to the insanity of the next wall layer.

My two cents...

 

[hong]

1) By the book, there's nothing wrong with a keen, vorpal weapon. Just because the abilities add up to +6 doesn't make it illegal; it just means you're limited to a +4 enhancement bonus for the weapon. However, IMO the vorpal enchantment is silly and I would strike it out from a game that I run.

2) Nothing stops people from teleporting inside a prismatic sphere, as far as I know.

3) You take all the damage (and other effects) in 1 round. The "one at a time" clause means that you save against each effect individually, in the order given. Passing through a prismatic sphere/wall generally isn't a good idea.

 

[Christian]

And, the understatement of the year goes to ... (opens envelope) ... Hong!

Passing through a prismatic sphere/wall generally isn't a good idea.

 

[Cloudgatherer]

Regarding Prismatic...

You could teleport by a wall, but you cannot teleport inside the sphere. Attempting to teleport inside simply fails, it does not mean the teleporter suffers all the effects of the wall.

 

[SpikeyFreak]

Vorpal Keen Weapons:

The limit of +5 is only for enhancement bonus, it isn't for enchantments. As long as the enhancemnt plus the market price modifier is +10 or less and the enhancement is +5 or less, it is legal.

Monte posted that he has a HOUSE RULE that the vorpal enchantment only works on the natural crit range of the weapon, so keen, imp. crit., etc., wouldn't make it more likely to kill.

Are you the DM? All you have to do is say, "The vorpal enchantment does not exist in my game." Problem solved. I agree with sentiments that Caliban has presented in the past: Save or die effects really suck, and vorpal doesn't even allow a save. I disallowed it in my game.

If they argue, ask them if they really want the DM to be able to make a weapon master with a keen rapier who has the imp. crit and power attack feats as their nemisis. Don't let them forget that you can give every bad guy in the game armor of fortification.

--Jabberwocky Spikey

 

[Rashak Mani]

I´m 100% in agreement with you Spikey... problem is its a duel I was "invited" to DM... not my campaign or world. So my calls should be based more on rules than lets say good sense, etc... I do agree in general that vorpal keen is a sick puppy and shouldnt be allowed. I just didnt follow those threads back then until the end.

Even if the Board members overall consensus isnt exactly "The Law" it does have very good weight juriprudencially speaking if I do forbid the Vorpal Keen... or Vorpal Dancing...

 

[el Voz]

Every time your players make a weapon that makes you cringe, Have a villian carry the same weapon.

 

[hong]

Regarding Prismatic...

You could teleport by a wall, but you cannot teleport inside the sphere. Attempting to teleport inside simply fails, it does not mean the teleporter suffers all the effects of the wall.

That sentence "stops all spells" is an unfortunate hangover from 1E/2E days. Life would be much more straightforward if they'd translated it to 3E terms. I would interpret it as meaning "stops line of effect".

 

[Phoenix8008]

If they argue, ask them if they really want the DM to be able to make a weapon master with a keen rapier who has the imp. crit and power attack feats as their nemisis.

I didn't think you could make a rapier keen because it's a piercing weapon instead of a slashing weapon!? Unless I missed some errata somewhere. Please enlighten me(and sorry for the slight detour in this thread. You'll be returned to your regularly scheduled thread right away folks!).