Olympics Talk: A brief discussion before it goes away

Mannahnin

Scion of Murgen (He/Him)
I don't know. I think you have to give people autonomy over their own bodies. People should be informed. But these convoluted arguments about all the factors involved....at the end of the day people choose to do this, provided they aren't being pressured by someone else or something.
That's a big proviso. Kids who are physically gifted are often groomed and inculcated into these sports which cause repeated head injuries (especially football in big portions of the US), from quite a young age. They get encouraged and steered into these sports long before they have any ability whatsoever to comprehend the risks and long-term impact of the sport and CTE.
 
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Snarf Zagyg

Notorious Liquefactionist
Supporter
This. The motto for the Olympics is "higher, faster, stronger", not "more artistic", which is inevitably subjective.

O Sport, you are Beauty! ...
O Sport, you are Justice! ...
O Sport, you are Happiness!
The body trembles in bliss upon hearing your call ...


The opening of Ode to Sport. Winner, Gold Medal. Poetry. 1908 Olympics.

Fun fact- The winner was actually Pierre de Coubertin, the founder of the modern Olympics. Writing under a pseudonym. I'm sure that it was legit.

Anyway, the Olympics used to have categories for, inter alia, music, literature, poetry, and architecture (!) with medals for each. They had to be about sport. This continued through 1952.

Suddenly, the phrase dancing about architecture has a whole 'nother meaning.
 

Snarf Zagyg

Notorious Liquefactionist
Supporter
Also, if you have HBO Max, go watch the John Oliver bit on the World Games (S11 E17, aired 7/21/24)! You can see it here-

Link to youtube video, geolocked.

But it is geolocked for most of you ('Murikuh).

If you thought the Olympics had wacky games, the World Games is for all the sports that are too wacky for the Olympics (BLADE SPORTS! CHESSBOXING!) or that the Olympics no longer carries (tug of war).
 

Bedrockgames

I post in the voice of Christopher Walken
That's a big proviso. Kids who are physically gifted are often groomed and inculcated into these sports which cause repeated head injuries (especially football in big portions of the US), from quite a young age. They get encouraged and steered into these sports long before they have any ability whatsoever to comprehend the risks and long-term impact of the sport and CTE.
It is, and it varies from sport to sport. I think probably varies a lot by region. I can imagine in football there is a lot of pressure, especially since it is a standard high school sport and common enough in college that many athletes use it to get a scholarship. Boxing, at least where I am in my region of the US, from what I have seen, this is not usually the case. I am sure it happens. One thing about boxing is you do want to start young if you want to really be good, so there is a catch 22 involved in that respect. But mostly what I saw, and what I experienced from my own grandfather, was it is usually a kid who is very determined to box, and the parents are normally reluctant. I think with football we can talk ourselves into it just being a sport like any other. With boxing that is hard to do. If you encourage your child to participate in boxing you are going to see them hitting and getting hit. The aim of boxing is just a lot more obvious and clear, so it is harder to talk around it being about fighting. I will say, I think it is important for a sport like boxing to protect young people, and to avoid having kids enter who are there because they are being pressured. I am all for the sport being well regulated.

But I also don't think boxing is as casual about this stuff as it used to be. With newer coaches I think there is a lot more awareness of CTE these days. I don't think they take it lightly. And even back in the day, people knew about pugilistic dementia (You can find quotes from Muhammad Ali talking about how he fought the way he did, rather ironically, to avoid taking brain damage: apparently he was very concerned about it). With Football, I think people were surprised to learn how much damage tackling does to the brain. But with boxing it is a sport that is largely about taking blows to the head, so even as a kid, you know it can cause brain damage. I think what was surprising to people was that even smaller concussions just from regular sparring can add up and can make you more vulnerable if you keep getting hit while you have them.

All that said. You are getting hit in the head. It is going to damage your brain. There is no getting around that. At the end of the day, I think you need to let people make that choice for themselves. And I would just restate for those who haven't done it, I think they don't understand why people would risk their minds for a violent sport. Can there be pressure and other factors? Can young people not be well informed when they make the choice? Sure. But a lot of people sign up for it knowing full well what the risks are.
 

Scribe

Legend
I think what was surprising to people was that even smaller concussions just from regular sparring can add up and can make you more vulnerable if you keep getting hit while you have them.

You dont even need a concussion. Hell, you dont even need to be hit in the head. Soccer, and not from hitting the ball with the head, leads to tons of concussions.

The brain is not meant to be bouncing around, in fact most sport takes the body to a place it simply was not intended to be at.

We didnt evolve to smash our shins into another guys ribs, but I'm here for it.
 

Bedrockgames

I post in the voice of Christopher Walken
You dont even need a concussion. Hell, you dont even need to be hit in the head. Soccer, and not from hitting the ball with the head, leads to tons of concussions.

The brain is not meant to be bouncing around, in fact most sport takes the body to a place it simply was not intended to be at.

We didnt evolve to smash our shins into another guys ribs, but I'm here for it.

I was surprised when I learned about soccer having problems with it
 

Bedrockgames

I post in the voice of Christopher Walken
Also, if you have HBO Max, go watch the John Oliver bit on the World Games (S11 E17, aired 7/21/24)! You can see it here-

Link to youtube video, geolocked.

But it is geolocked for most of you ('Murikuh).

If you thought the Olympics had wacky games, the World Games is for all the sports that are too wacky for the Olympics (BLADE SPORTS! CHESSBOXING!) or that the Olympics no longer carries (tug of war).

I am actually kind of intrigued by chess boxing. It is definitely gimmicky but it is interesting to watch

I have no problem with broad acceptance of different events in the olympics. Also it brings more viewers. If it is all track and field for example, people who don't like track and field don't watch. This isn't an argument against track and field, I simply don't watch those events (I understand they are popular and bring in viewers). The thing that got me to start watching was TKD and boxing. I don't particularly care about watching people run or jump over a bar. I also found I liked events that demonstrated a lot of grace of movement. As long as the focus is on perfection towards a particular event, I am fine with it. If someone can become a zen master of skee ball, I'd have no issue with that being taken to the olympic level.
 

Scribe

Legend
I was surprised when I learned about soccer having problems with it
Yeah me too, my Dad and I had a number of discussions over it. He coached Football for decades, I grew up playing it, and it was around when all this started to make noise with various NFL players getting in the news (Junior Seau being a big one) when I said "Hey man, I get it this is part of your life's work, but I've got the damage, and I was out on the edge, not in the trenches getting a micro concussion every 30 seconds.".

Its something I've debated with most of my sons life, I wanted him to play football, but in the end I'm not sure the damage is worth it, so we didnt put him in it.

My Dad continues to push the 'yeah but Soccer..' and I just say 'well then maybe there are other things we should be doing to build character'.

Then again, my son insisted on doing Muay Thai when he was younger, but never got into the sparring side before he grew out of it...
 


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