D&D (2024) One D&D playtest, abilities that recharge when you roll initiative.

[darjr]

That recovers on a short rest (exactly like 4e encounter powers do), not on rolling initiative (which is what you were praising as superior design to 4e encounter powers).

I wasn’t pressing it as better. I said I liked it better.

And read it again.

Edit to add: OK I did say I thought it was better. But praising it is a little strong.

 

[Charlaquin]

I wasn’t pressing it as better. I said I liked it better.

And read it again.

Ok.

It is the basis for the return of stealth encounter powers.

This is a much better idea though. Imho.

No “I like” to be found here.

It feels more organic and tied to in fiction action.

Like a short rest?

Plus it doesn’t limit things to an “encounter”, potentially, just the pacing of them.

Like rolling initiative?

 

[darjr]

Ok.

No “I like” to be found here.

Like a short rest?

Like rolling initiative?

Up look at my edit we crossed. And yes the boon recharges on initiative, just like I said. Also on a short or long rest.

 

[Charlaquin]

Up look at my edit we crossed. And yes the boon recharges on initiative, just like I said. Also on a short or long rest.

Then it isn’t really appropriate to contrast with a 4e encounter power, is it?

 

[darjr]

Then it isn’t really appropriate to contrast with a 4e encounter power, is it?

Of coarse it is.

I wasn't lamenting the recharge on a short rest. I think you folks brought that up.

You also said they couldn't be used out side of combat, and that the text didn't have rolling on initiative. Both of which are wrong.

The 4e encounter power that isn't actually an "encounter" power has it's first definition in the PHB describing it as being about encounters.

I don't know why you dig in so deep on these things. It's really tiring.

Yes I like it better. Its definition is tied better to in fiction things, imho, being tied to initiative also makes it clearer what they are for, especially the ones that are combat oriented.

Yes are they very much like 4e encounter powers, sure, a more refined version imho. It is in my opinion more fiction first vs mechanics first.

 

[Charlaquin]

Of coarse it is.

I wasn't lamenting the recharge on a short rest. I think you folks brought that up.

There’s no folks. Please engage with me when you’re engaging with me, not with everyone you imagine holds a similar position to me.

You also said they couldn't be used out side of combat, and that the text didn't have rolling on initiative. Both of which are wrong.

Features which recharge on rolling initiative can’t easily be used outside of combat. The Epic Boon you quoted is not an example of such a feature, since it also recovers on a short or long rest.

The 4e encounter power that isn't actually an "encounter" power has its first definition in the PHB describing it as being about encounters.

I don't know why you dig in so deep on these things. It's really tiring.

It says they can be used once per encounter, which is true. They are not, however, defined in relation to encounters, as you claimed, because neither their usage nor their recovery are tied to encounters. That’s why I dig in: because your critique is inaccurate. If you think it’s tiring that I “dig in on these things,” try to imagine how it must feel when critiques of a thing you enjoy are consistently factually inaccurate.

Yes I like it better. Its definition is tied better to in fiction things, imho, being tied to initiative also makes it clearer what they are for, especially the ones that are combat oriented.

Yes are they very much like 4e encounter powers, sure, a more refined version imho. It is in my opinion more fiction first vs mechanics first.

But it literally is the opposite. 4e encounter powers are factually tied to an in-fiction thing, and 1D&D features that recover only on rolling initiative are factually tied to combat encounters. That is exactly the opposite of the reasoning you are using to praise the latter in contrast to the former.

You’re allowed to like these features better than 4e encounter powers but your stated reasoning for doing so is counterfactual. You might want to reconsider why you actually like these better, but moreover, please stop perpetuating misinformation about 4e.

 

[darjr]

There’s no folks. Please engage with me when you’re engaging with me, not with everyone you imagine holds a similar position to me.

There are "folks", but OK.

Features which recharge on rolling initiative can’t easily be used outside of combat. The Epic Boon you quoted is not an example of such a feature, since it also recovers on a short or long rest.

That feature I quoted says this "you can’t use it again until you roll Initiative or finish a Short Rest or a Long Rest." It recharges on both, and can be used out side of combat. Easily, just make a non-combat test. I didn't limit to only initiative and I don't now. I don't know why you are except to arbitrarily constrain the discussion.

it says they can be used once per encounter, which is true. They are not, however, defined in relation to encounters, as you claimed, because neither their usage nor their recovery are tied to encounters. That’s why I dig in: because your critique is inaccurate. If you think it’s tiring that I “dig in on these things,” try to imagine how it must feel when critiques of a thing you enjoy are consistently factually inaccurate.

The very definition of Encounter Powers talks about Encounters. I'm not talking about whether or not it can or can not be used during an encounter. I've said this several times now.

But it literally is the opposite. 4e encounter powers are factually tied to an in-fiction thing, and 1D&D features that recover only on rolling initiative are factually tied to combat encounters. That is exactly the opposite of the reasoning you are using to praise the latter in contrast to the former.

And this. I don't get the disconnect here.

How is the start of violence not in fiction? It's violence in the fiction that triggers the rules for initiative.

 

[darjr]

@Charlaquin Also I'm done.

If it makes you feel better I'll change the title of the thread.

This is not a 4e thread.

 

[Charlaquin]

That feature I quoted says this "you can’t use it again until you roll Initiative or finish a Short Rest or a Long Rest." It recharges on both, and can be used out side of combat. Easily, just make a non-combat test. I didn't limit to only initiative and I don't now. I don't know why you are except to arbitrarily constrain the discussion.

Recovering on a short or long rest is what 4e encounter powers do, so since you were contrasting initiative recovery with encounter powers, the Boon you quoted is not an example of that.

The very definition of Encounter Powers talks about Encounters. I'm not talking about whether or not it can or can not be used during an encounter. I've said this several times now.

You’re focusing on prose instead of how encounter powers actually function. Which is pretty typical of critiques of 4e - entirely focused on aesthetic nitpicks, completely ignoring actual gameplay function.

And this. I don't get the disconnect here.

How is the start of violence not in fiction? It's violence in the fiction that triggers the rules for initiative.

Rolling initiative is a thing that occurs in the fiction, both in 1D&D and in 4e. But for some reason you critique 4e encounter powers for being tied to encounters (even though they aren’t) in the same breath that you praise 1D&D initiative recovery powers for… being tied to encounters.

 

[Charlaquin]

He actually blocked me!