Only the Lonely: Why We Demand Official Product

  • Thread starter Thread starter lowkey13
  • Start date Start date
I really love to see people play and create homebrew adventures and settings. There is a nice young man in out FLGS that is running his own adventure in a dinosaur setting. He really loves jurrasic park. His players seem to be having a blast. And he had the same group playing for about 3 months. I look at him and what he is doing and I think to myself that is what D&D is all about. I hope to play in his group down the road.

I would much rather play something like that then play an published adventure where I definitely can tell some players are reading the module before they come in to play in a group.
 

log in or register to remove this ad


Nothing in D&D is distinctly anything, then. You can have defiler and preserver abilities in any setting you feel like.
Half-giants are rather distinctive. To the best of my knowledge no setting but Dark Sun has ever featured them. Similarly defiling magic.

Whereas Purple Dragon Knights are just knights. Not unlike Knights of the Hart. And Scarlet Brotherhood monks are just Open Hand monks (ie they are 1st ed PHB monks).

Similarly GH vikings are (just) vikings.

GH doesn't need mechanically distinctive elements because it is (deliberately) out-of-the-box D&D. D&D was written to do Greyhawk, rather than vice versa.
 

the more anti-medieval piece there is that so many cultures and races are able to coexist so peacefully, practically like today's New York.
What do you have in mind? Mediaeval Egypt/Palestine/Syria/Byazntium/Scily/Southern Italy had many cultures and religions coexisting - Armenian, Byzantine/Greek, Turkish, Arab, Frankish/Norman, etc. The conflicts that occurred weren't exclusively or even really primarily on cultural or religious, as opposed to broadly political, lines.
 

Half-giants are rather distinctive. To the best of my knowledge no setting but Dark Sun has ever featured them. Similarly defiling magic.

Whereas Purple Dragon Knights are just knights. Not unlike Knights of the Hart. And Scarlet Brotherhood monks are just Open Hand monks (ie they are 1st ed PHB monks).

Similarly GH vikings are (just) vikings.

GH doesn't need mechanically distinctive elements because it is (deliberately) out-of-the-box D&D. D&D was written to do Greyhawk, rather than vice versa.
While you are right. Generally whether this sort of material is needed rarely stops it being printed.

There's plenty of things in Greyhawk that could be subclasses, just like they were prestige classes in 3E. So you could have subclasses for various knighthoods, you could have a subclass for the scarlett brotherhood etc. This seems to be how 3rd Party material handles these things anyway.

It's certainly not what I would like to see from a Greyhawk book. I certainly don't think there's any concepts in Greyhawk that couldn't be played with what already exists.

(Actually I think WOTC may have learned their lesson here. I'm not sure there's been anything they've release along these lines since the Sword Coast Adventurer's guide. )
 

What I'd like for a Greyhawk book is something more aimed at GMs and building a campaign.

Maybe sort of double it up as a book for making a campaign world with Greyhawk as the example. Present a basic framework and then give multiple ways the campaign could go and options. Present possibilities - maybe the Greyhawk Wars are the future of the setting - maybe they're not. Maybe Rary will turn out to be a traitor, maybe he won't. Take all the later canon, and instead focus on how it could be turned into campaigns.

Maybe aim the book at GMs who want to transition from running adventure paths to creating their own material and provide them with some frameworks to do so.

Take the whole idea of canon, load it into a cannon, and fire it into the sun.
 
Last edited:

Heh. Funny you should mention this. I just had to have some Scarlet Brotherhood monks in my Ghosts of Saltmarsh game.

Reskinned Githzerai monks and poof, instant Scarlet Brothers.

And if I don't want to do that?

Please leave my beloved Greyhawk out of your wish list.

No.

You like and want what you like and want, and I will do the same.
 

I did graduate work focusing on anachronism in Medieval and Early Modern European thought, so it's actually one of the things that fascinates me about D&D.
I'll agree as long as by "some respects" we mean a very few respects. Fundamentally, outside of the more familiar elements of material culture, these settings have nothing really to do with either era. And fundamentally even enthusiasts of these periods tend to have a very shaky understanding of them so it couldn't really be any other way. Even if the settings were designed by medieval studies PhDs almost no players and DMs would actually run it true to the era.
The difficulties in trying to run an "authentically" mediaeval RPG are almost insuperable, I think.

Even if one overcomes the problem of working out what is the truth about the mediaeval period - itself the subject of dispute among those best-educated in the field - there is what I think is an even bigger problem in the RPG context, namely, outlook and motivation. Both my own play experiences, and reading others on these boards, make me think that very few RPGers want, or are able, to play characters whose outlook is not modern. One sees this most starkly, but not at all exclusively, in discussions of paladins and alignment where behaviour that falls broadly within the romantic/honourable self-conception of a mediaeval warrior is labelld as "lawful stupid".

I'm currently most of the way through the second volume of Runciman's three-volume history of the crusades. Any expert mediaevalist probably has views on the correctness of its approach and account; I'm not qualified in that respect. But he has a lot of footnotes to primary sources and so I assume that the basic recount is largely accurate. Here is one story he tells, loosely summarised:

In the mid-twelfth century a Frankish army is on campaign against Nur ad-Din. They encounter some soldiers whom they take to be scouts, but they then realise they've encountered Nur ad-Din's main force. This is because they hear the whinny of a mule which had been a gift from the Franks to a sheikh whom they knew to be riding with Nur ad-Din in his army - per Runciman, the mule whinnied because it recognised the smell of the Frankish horses that it used to hang out with.

When one starts to extrapolate from this story to everything it implies about social and political relationships, the apparent lack of correlation between personal affiliations and loyalties on the one hand and "political" ones on the other, gift-giving between ostensible enemies, etc, one gets glimpses of a world which no D&D game I'm aware of has ever emulated.

How often in the history of D&D play has a party of PCs found itself fighting someone riding a steed that was a gift from the PCs, and this isn't a sign of betrayal, or of some fundamental change in loyalties (eg Kitiara in Dragolance), but is just what one expects, because duty (which everyone acknowledges to have almost overwhelming importance) brings acquaintances, even friends and allies, into conflict?
 


While you are right. Generally whether this sort of material is needed rarely stops it being printed.
Fully agreed. But that's why I've said that I don't think there would be anything distinctively GH about such mechanical elements. (Just as I don't see anything distinctively FR about the Purple Dragon Knight beyond the name.)
 

Remove ads

Top