D&D 5E [OOC] A Light Hearted Princes of Elemental Evil Hack and Slash

[Shayuri]

Hee...we're so fragile... Rounds like this make me miss 4e a little. (^_^)

 

[hafrogman]

Fixing the rolls.

attack - [roll0]
damage - [roll1]

 

[Steve Gorak]

OOC: Isn't there one other monk that needs to attack? WRT the frostbite spell, RAW it doesn't work, but it was written before the errata was released. With that said, it's one of the most powerful cantrips across all the books so limiting it to not affect unarmed attacks or natural attacks isn't unreasonable, IMO

I figured I'd move this to the OCC thread as to not interfere with what's happening IC.
I'm not sure how frostbite is one of the most powerful cantrips [MENTION=95059]Forged Fury[/MENTION]. It targets constitution, and if you take into account that it's not applicable to unarmed attacks (including monster's natural weapons, I assume), you're left with weapon-wielding foes. Fighters and barbarians are proficient in Con saves, and casters could just cast a spell that doesn't require an attack roll for a couple of rounds. This seems to nerf it's usefulness...
I'm curious to hear why you think it's that powerful.
Cheers,

SG

 

[Forged Fury]

Sure, it targets Constitution. If you're thinking about it being ineffective against enemies with PC classes, then sure, but that's an atypical opponent. There are plenty of humanoids that don't have great Con saves, and relatively few monsters or NPCs have proficiency in Con saves (some classes of monsters do, like Devils and stuff, but they also usually have Magic Resistance, which sucks all around for casters). Of the NPCs and humanoid monsters (all of which are usually going to be using weapons and are the most often encountered) listed in the DM Basic Rules, only one NPC has a CON save of +4 or higher (the Knight) and none of the humanoids do. Even getting into other monsters, there are very few that add proficiency to their CON saves, they're just rolling straight stats. A minotaur, for instance, only has a +3 to that save, while you are likely to have a DC of 14 or higher by level 4 or so.

The rider effect is, IMO, the best generally available rider status effect offered by the various cantrips. Unable to heal, taking away their reaction, and slowing them are all pretty situational, albeit useful in the right circumstances.

So yeah, I think that Frostbite is, in most circumstances, one of the more powerful cantrips right out of the box. Sure, one could scour message boards and reddit to copy questionable tricks with other cantrips that may make them seem more powerful, but a lot of that is up to DM permissiveness. Even with its limitations concerning niche cases like monks and more general cases like creatures with natural weapons, I think frostbite is universally more useful.

ETA: You know what, I'm going to retract one of my thoughts. I think monster natural weapon attacks (bite, claw, etc.) count as weapon attacks given the verbiage from the Monster Manual:

The most common actions that a monster will take in combat are melee and ranged attacks. These can be spell attacks or weapon attacks, where the "weapon" might be a manufactured item or a natural weapon, such as a claw or tail spike.

So, I do think that frostbite, per RAW, affects monster natural weapons, but not a monk's unarmed strike, since it is still an unarmed strike (and, thus, not a weapon under 5E rules). That makes frostbite generally more useful.

 

[Steve Gorak]

Fair points [MENTION=95059]Forged Fury[/MENTION], thanks for the input. I might keep that cantrip since it can apply to monsters. It's so weird that monks fall under a special category, but hey, that's life!
Cheers,

SG

 

[Forged Fury]

I'd keep it. Are you planning on going further as a Sorcerer? You could pick up Heighten (I think that's the one) as a Metamagic and force disadvantage on saves. That can help getting around targeting something's good saves.

 

[Steve Gorak]

I'd keep it. Are you planning on going further as a Sorcerer? You could pick up Heighten (I think that's the one) as a Metamagic and force disadvantage on saves. That can help getting around targeting something's good saves.

Yep. I'm done with Warlock and the plan will be to continue strait sorcerer. The next level is going to hurt a bit, although Thaliss will be getting his 2nd eldrich blast The next level (6) will be fun!
Cheers,

SG

 

[hafrogman]

Stunned
Miss
Parried
Miss

I remember when I was a useful party member. Excuse me while I go soak some more damage for you guys. *sigh*

5th level cannot come soon enough. Two attacks, glorious! Then they'll be sorry they don't have Tolan IDon'tGiveMyCharactersLastNames to kick around anymore!

 

[Forged Fury]

I take it Dent has no spells left? Because that is absolutely when you Diving Strike, LOL.

 

[CanadienneBacon]

I got nothing.