ORCUS! EXCLUSIVE! ESCAPIST!

The Escapist has an awesome preview of Orcus himself! And by preview, I mean the stats -- along with some background features for Out of the Abyss. He's a CR 26 monster, wielding his famous wand. Also interesting his the quote from Chris Perkins, who clarified that the PCs would not fight him directly, but that "Fortunately, Out of the Abyss gives characters the chance to amass a small army and also turn the demon lords against one another, thus weakening them. There are also a couple other ways to banish the demon lords back to the Abyss, which is the party's ultimate goal."

For more, click on either of the images below! For tons more Out of the Abyss coverage, click here! It comes out September 15th (or the 4th in preferred stores - that's next Friday!)

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[fuindordm]

I know, but at the same time this is just an avatar of Orcus, right? A relatively weak prime material plane manifestation.

 

[MonsterEnvy]

(1) I think there should be a line under the Wand of Orcus that says "If Orcus is the one wielding the wand, it doesn't use any charges at all. Orcus is the Demon Lord of Undead and can use his Wand at-will".

(2) His AC needs to be a bit higher; I'm thinking... 24 for some reason, 30 with the Wand in his hands.

(3) As a Bonus Action, he can have any undead within 30' of him leap in front of any attack at him that would have otherwise have hit him; the undead taking the full force of the attack in stead of Orcus.

(4) He has the ability to Hover, as long as he can still Fly.

(5)[Lair Action] Anything that drops to 0hp or lower within 120' of him is raised the next round as an undead being, fully under Orcus' control; the newly formed undead has all the capabilities of it's former self when it died, but becomes Chaotic Evil and fanatically devoted to Orcus. There is no save/protection against this.

Some things you should know. The Wand of Orcus is already adjusted for Orcus holding it. The DMG version states that when Orcus holds the Wand all of it's powers cost 2 charges less (Min 0) The Wand is still a Wand and has limits. He can't just spam Power Word Kill for free.

AC is fine. Also the Wand gives him a +3 to AC +3 is the highest a bonus goes in 5e.

The bonus action undead thing does not make sense he can only use bonus actions on his turn. What you wanted to say was as Reaction he can have an undead jump infront of an attack. I don't think he needs it, but it's a fine power.

Don't get the point about the Hover thing. He is not going to be brought down easily and even then he can't take damage from falling.

The lair action is kind of mean and uneeded he already has the lair action to bring any corpse back to life as a ghoul, skeleton or zombie.



Anyway Orcus is plenty strong. He is out of most players leagues but I do think he should be beatable.

 

[turkeygiant]

Anyway Orcus is plenty strong. He is out of most players leagues but I do think he should be beatable.

I totally agree, Orcus' place in D&D has always been as a very top tier monster who can still be challenged by PCs using their usual tactics, I don't think he has ever been a gimmicky almost "narrative combat" monster like the Tarrasque or a god like Tiamat. He wishes he was that powerful but sadly he gets ganked by adventurers every time he tries to level up...

 

[Eric V]

I know, but at the same time this is just an avatar of Orcus, right? A relatively weak prime material plane manifestation.

I don't know...I don't see that anywhere. Hm.

I think it's plenty tough as it is...even if one is "prepared" to fight undead, bringing in a bunch of demiliches is going to mess you up.

Surprised no one has posted the most optimal (if general) summoning for Orcus yet.

Orcus has been eminently beat-able since the beginning; 5e is hardly breaking new ground here.

 

[Mirtek]

I know, but at the same time this is just an avatar of Orcus, right? A relatively weak prime material plane manifestation.

No, that's him in all his glory. Just like the stats for Tiamat in RoT are her true self and also not merely an avatar

 

[hawkeyefan]

I've no problem at all with Orcus being beatable. That's how he was in 1st Edition. He and most of the other demon princes and the like should be within a party's ability to face.

That being said, I think this version is extremely tough. Especially in his lair. It'd be an extremely tough fight, with no guarantee of success.

 

[steeldragons]

I don't see the "look how easy this guy is" attitude.

Truesight to 120'. So forget any invisibility, illusion, magical hiding/sneaking/disguising yourself to get close. And a PP of 22. There's no sneaking up on this guy.

Resistance on fire, cold, and lightning...with Advantage on ALL magic saves.

Advantage on all magic saves...and 3 "get out of damage/effect free cards" via Legendary Saves.

If those are used up (or not), there's 3 Dispel Magics (at 17th level, it would seem).

...and a Time Stop! Granted only once...but it's a friggin' Time Stop. This could shut down the whole party.

Also once per day, his 500 HP worth of undead...Don't sell this short. This is NOT just he can waste some time with skeletons & zombies...The ability is summoning UNDEAD! As long as you don't exceed 500 HP mix 'em up as you like....A flight of demi-liches...a body guard of vampires...a battalion of 60 5HP skeletons with 5 40HP Wraiths or Ghosts floating/flying around...while he's taking his normal actions and...

...and then there's the 3 legendary actions between his turns.

I think a lot of folks aren't really getting how to use/work with Legendary Actions, yet.

 

[charcoalninja]

I don't see the "look how easy this guy is" attitude.

Resistance on fire, cold, and lightning....remember, in 5e, that's not 1/2 save for 1/4....that's 1/2 save for NO damage! ...with Advantage on ALL magic saves.

Advantage on all magic saves...and 3 "get out of damage/effect free cards" via Legendary Saves.

If those are used up (or not), there's 3 Dispel Magics (at 17th level, it would seem).

...and a Time Stop! Granted only once...but it's a friggin' Time Stop. This could shut down the whole party.

Also once per day, his 500 HP worth of undead...Don't sell this short. This is NOT just he can waste some time with skeletons & zombies...The ability is summoning UNDEAD! As long as you don't exceed 500 HP mix 'em up as you like....A flight of demi-liches...a body guard of vampires...a battalion of 60 5HP skeletons with 5 40HP Wraiths or Ghosts floating/flying around...while he's taking his normal actions and...

Truesight to 120'. So forget any invisibility, illusion, magical hiding/sneaking/disguising yourself to get close. And a PP of 22. There's no sneaking up on this guy.

...and then there's the 3 legendary actions between his turns.

I think a lot of folks aren't really getting how to use/work with Legendary Actions, yet.

Resistance doesn't work that way. It's half damage received, it doesn't miraculously change you into taking no damage. You need evasion for that.

As for his other abilities, they won't matter if he doesn't get more than one turn. He has a piddly 400ish HP, PCs will be able to Alpha strike the hell out of that, a high level fighter alone will probably take out 1/3 to 1/2 of that HP in his first round. His AC is pathetic and his HP likewise. It's sad that the liches he can summon are vastly more of a threat than he is himself. A single Paladin smite 2d6+15+6d8 is an average of 49 damage, so with extra attack a Paladin alone takes him down by almost 1/4 of his HP (98) without even truely going Nova by burning a spell slot on an actual smite spell, heaven forbid if the pally crits or has Polearm master for ANOTHER attack. To hit: +6+5+1 = +12 hits him on an 8, Vengance pally has advantage on all attacks from enmity so effectively hits him on a 3.

His Passive Perception of 22, is nothing against a Rogue/Bard's +17 mods, they sneak up on this guy on a 5. With Enhanced ability they have advantage on the roll. Add expertise to deception and the rogue or bard can zombie dance their way up to him ala thriller and flatten him.

The only thing that makes him even remotely noteworthy as an opponent is that he can summon liches and other nasty undead. His army of minions are far more threatening than the big guy himself, hell a single lich is far more deadly than this chump. It recharges up to 8th level spell slots with its legendary action... he just tail slaps you...

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

heaven forbid if the pally crits or has Polearm master for ANOTHER attack.

He doesn't need Polearm Master. Anyone can draw a dagger with their offhand and use a bonus action to attack with it. Yeah, no +STR but he'll still get +d8 radiant and the opportunity to smite. All he loses is shield AC, which is totally worth it against Orcus.

 

[Sacrosanct]

No matter how many times 5e has shown that theorycrafting is a useless endeavor, it seems people will always resort to it to make assumptions.

For one, I highly doubt Orcus is just sitting there in an arena for your entire full resourced optimized party to walk in. We have no idea the context in which he could be encountered, secondly. And thirdly, theorycrafting relies on a buttload of assumptions, all in the party's favor.