OSRIC: something for the old schoolers

[JRRNeiklot]

I, personally, will buy a copy of any half-way decent product which can be used with AD&D/C&C or Hackmaster. I don't think I'm alone. There has to be a market for this. A publisher might not get rich, but he should be able to make enough to tip the girls at the jiggly room.

 

[dagger]

I, personally, will buy a copy of any half-way decent product which can be used with AD&D/C&C or Hackmaster. I don't think I'm alone. There has to be a market for this. A publisher might not get rich, but he should be able to make enough to tip the girls at the jiggly room.

Especially if he sips water

 

[PapersAndPaychecks]

I'm still a bit underwhelmed with what the goal is, though. People who already make 1E fan material like the stuff on Dragonsfoot aren't going to be changed by this: only those who want to sell it. And how many people is that, really? It's a small subset of an already small industry, who by their very nature don't usually buy new product: I fail to see how it's going to, as the announcement on Dragonsfoot said, "Change the market forever".

Still, I've downloaded it and will be keeping an eye on it's progress. If grognards get a sideways way to buy new modules for their favourite game of choice, that's cool: and if nothing else, when my 1E core rules finally wear out, at least I've got a PDF that tells me most of them! ;-)

Those who don't care about the ruleset from the game we grew up playing, and see it as superseded, won't see any effect at all from OSRIC. Likewise those who only download freebie .pdf's won't see much difference if any (although I hope that OSRIC will encourage the production of some of those).

But there are clearly people who want to produce printed materials based on OSRIC-like rules. Rob Kuntz is one of them -- but he's fortunate enough to have access to the CU ruleset which enables him to do that. Expeditious Retreat, from the post above, is another, and OSRIC is stimulating Expeditious Retreat into producing printed material for the system.

Based on Rob's sales through pre-order, there's clearly a demand for paid, printed OSRIC-like material. OSRIC is intended to have a similar effect to the OGL, in allowing anyone to make it. For people who care about that, the market will indeed be changed forever!

And that's what I meant by my post on DF.

 

[GQuail]

Based on Rob's sales through pre-order, there's clearly a demand for paid, printed OSRIC-like material. OSRIC is intended to have a similar effect to the OGL, in allowing anyone to make it. For people who care about that, the market will indeed be changed forever!

And that's what I meant by my post on DF.

Well, as you say, people are coming on board: so there clearly is some interest in getting "professional" products made under this license. And if it offers way to get some old-school designers to work on the product again, then hey, sounds good to me.

Still, I would stick to my point that this is serving a small group in a small hobby, and crucially a part of the hobby who by there very nature don't make as much of a habit of buying new product these days. And then there are some people on this very board for whom it won't be old school enough.... ;-)

 

[Henry]

...And then there are some people on this very board for whom it won't be old school enough.... ;-)

Well, I'm pretty sure you can't get much more old-school LEGALLY. (And buy new stuff, that is.) I've read it over, even printed a copy for myself, and I like having access to it. For me, it even works if I ever want to try and get my group to play a mini-series of AD&D stuff, and have enough rules-sets to pass around. Now, whether it stands the legal challenge, if there is one, remains to be seen, but I gotta thank Stuart and Matt for putting their time and rep where their mouth is.

 

[T. Foster]

Still, I would stick to my point that this is serving a small group in a small hobby, and crucially a part of the hobby who by there very nature don't make as much of a habit of buying new product these days.

This is the second time you've mentioned this, and I think you're overlooking what is essentially a chicken-egg situation: do "old schoolers" not buy new product because the new product doesn't appeal to them, or is product not being released that appeals to "old schoolers" because they don't buy new product? Taking myself as an example, I know that my recent "new" rpg purchases (i.e. not counting oop material picked up on ebay or through Mayfair's recent blowout sale) in the last five years or so have been very few and far between -- perhaps 2 to 3 products a year, or less -- and it would therefore be very accurate to describe me as someone who doesn't make much of a habit of buying new product. But it's not due to "my very nature," it's due to a lack of appealing product. If more product was being released that both appealed to my stylistic sensibilities and was easily usable with the games I play/prefer, I'd be much more likely to buy it. I actually lament the fact that there isn't more game-stuff out there I want to buy. I used to like going to game stores, browsing through the new releases, finding something exciting, and bringing it home, and would love to be able to do that again. Nowadays the only time I go to a game-store at all is if I'm looking for a specific title that I've heard about online. While I'm there I'll usually browse a little bit, but nothing ever catches my eye enough for me to actually walk out of the store with it...

 

[Corathon]

I am currently running 2 campaigns using AD&D 1E, so I'm very interested in any "OSRIC compatible" material that's published, whether PDF or print.

 

[GQuail]

This is the second time you've mentioned this, and I think you're overlooking what is essentially a chicken-egg situation: do "old schoolers" not buy new product because the new product doesn't appeal to them, or is product not being released that appeals to "old schoolers" because they don't buy new product? Taking myself as an example, I know that my recent "new" rpg purchases (i.e. not counting oop material picked up on ebay or through Mayfair's recent blowout sale) in the last five years or so have been very few and far between -- perhaps 2 to 3 products a year, or less -- and it would therefore be very accurate to describe me as someone who doesn't make much of a habit of buying new product. But it's not due to "my very nature," it's due to a lack of appealing product. If more product was being released that both appealed to my stylistic sensibilities and was easily usable with the games I play/prefer, I'd be much more likely to buy it. I actually lament the fact that there isn't more game-stuff out there I want to buy. I used to like going to game stores, browsing through the new releases, finding something exciting, and bringing it home, and would love to be able to do that again. Nowadays the only time I go to a game-store at all is if I'm looking for a specific title that I've heard about online. While I'm there I'll usually browse a little bit, but nothing ever catches my eye enough for me to actually walk out of the store with it...

There is merit in this, yes: plenty of people here play older editions and still pick up newer books for various reasons: much like I play 3rd ed and still make some old book purchases on EBay. Perhaps there are indeed hordes of classic RPG players who will jump at the chance to once again buy new product for their game of choice, and perhaps the ability to make money from it will encourage retro fans to jrelease product.

But we're treading somewhat in unmapped territory here. Since you don't have any OSRIC products yet to choose to buy, I dunno how much you're going to snap them up. How many people from Dragonsfoot and other retro enclafes will pay for product like this, especiallyw hen for years it's been fan communities keeping it alive? And perhaps more importantly, how many are going to buy the next one, and the one after that?

Part of the issue here is, like the OGL, what kind of products get made. With a smaller marketplace some of the issues of the D20 glut might be avoided, but there's still going to be the issue of whether we'll see modules, campaign settings, new rules unit or whatever released. There's a difference between how well Rob Kuntz' adventure and how good OSRIC Company Number 7's product does: and for OSRIC to matter in the long term, it's the latter we need to see perform well.

 

[GQuail]

Well, I'm pretty sure you can't get much more old-school LEGALLY. (And buy new stuff, that is.) I've read it over, even printed a copy for myself, and I like having access to it. For me, it even works if I ever want to try and get my group to play a mini-series of AD&D stuff, and have enough rules-sets to pass around.

Yeah, that is a real handy aspect to all this: much like the 3.X SRD, it's a free copy of the core rules do help players familiarise themselves with proceedings. If I were to run AD&D, I've only got my core rules to hand, and rather than go through the hassle of EBay purchases I'd far rather just hit "print". ;-)

 

[Treebore]

There is definitely a market for this stuff. C&C is making the Troll Lords enough money that they are able to do things, business wise, that they couldn't afford to do selling d20 material. Plus making C&C versatile enough to make using material from any edition of the game definitely makes me, and the whole C&C crowd, potential customers for OSRIC material.

So if the word gets out that OSRIC material is useable there is a market. A market that I think Joe Goodman has found worthwhile not only to do two C&C dedicated modules, but to also have more in the works. So OSRIC producers have the potential to not only tap the C&C market.

Its going to be hard to reach that market though. I just met a guy last night who plays 2E and wasn't even aware 3E existed.

He's coming over this weekend to try out C&C.

If he likes it he'll see about converting his group over.