D&D 5E Out of the Abyss: Dealing with the Twins

[TheNoremac42]

So my group tried doing Out of the Abyss a while back. It was going well, but we had to abandon it due to changing schedules for several players. However, there was one thing that irked me. The twins, Topsy and Turvy, seem to be pretty OP - at least in the beginning. The damage immunity from their lycanthropy basically defaults them to the tanks of the group right next to Derendil(?). During the prison break, they took on three guards simply through attrition.

In order to balance them, they way we played it was that since they rejected the curse they only got resistance to regular weapon damage instead of outright immunity. Did anyone else have any balance problems with the NPCs? How did yall deal with them?

P.S. The pyscho one with the god complex murdered half the group before we even reached Darklake.

 

[Sorcerers Apprentice]

So my group tried doing Out of the Abyss a while back. It was going well, but we had to abandon it due to changing schedules for several players. However, there was one thing that irked me. The twins, Topsy and Turvy, seem to be pretty OP - at least in the beginning. The damage immunity from their lycanthropy basically defaults them to the tanks of the group right next to Derendil(?). During the prison break, they took on three guards simply through attrition.

In order to balance them, they way we played it was that since they rejected the curse they only got resistance to regular weapon damage instead of outright immunity. Did anyone else have any balance problems with the NPCs? How did yall deal with them?

P.S. The pyscho one with the god complex murdered half the group before we even reached Darklake.

The twins are hiding their curse, so they might try to avoid getting hit so they don't reveal that it doesn't hurt them.

 

[MarkB]

I think the key is to not put them in the position of being damage sponges in the first place - and that goes for the rest of the NPCs. With so many additional characters potentially running around, if you allow combats to focus around them, the PCs can start taking a backseat. So yeah, play them as preferring to sneak around and plink at the enemy from range. Let them tank a few hits, but either play it out as the strike having apparently been a glancing blow that missed due to armour, or as them having a deal of resilience and not letting their wounds slow them down.

In this case, though, the lid is somewhat off due to their actions during the prison break.

I would suggest simply accelerating the timescale on their particular issues. Have the moon become full sometime soon, during the journey through the Underdark, and play out their transformation as something of a social skill challenge.

If the party is willing and able to persuade them both, they resist the curse and refuse to change, and stay with the group, but say they can't take the lead in combat because they're afraid that if they're hurt they might still lose control and accidentally hurt a friend.

If even one of them is not successfully persuaded, that one will go full wererat and flee the group, and their twin will follow.

If the party react poorly to the revelation of the twins' nature, or roll really badly at persuading them, they go full wererat and leap to attack.

Incidentally, I did eventually have the twins hit with a full moon - I had it happen during the sacrifice ceremony at Sloobudoop, positing that the Kuo Toa had timed it to coincide with a spring tide - and one question that came up at that point for me was how long it takes for the curse of lycanthropy to take hold on a new victim. The Monster Manual doesn't suggest any delayed onset, but in fiction the transformation tends to be more gradual. As a result, when they attacked one of the Kuo Toa and bit him, he immediately sprouted fur and a rat-tail as it was still a full moon, which felt a little bit off.

 

[TheNoremac42]

I think the key is to not put them in the position of being damage sponges in the first place - and that goes for the rest of the NPCs. With so many additional characters potentially running around, if you allow combats to focus around them, the PCs can start taking a backseat. So yeah, play them as preferring to sneak around and plink at the enemy from range. Let them tank a few hits, but either play it out as the strike having apparently been a glancing blow that missed due to armour, or as them having a deal of resilience and not letting their wounds slow them down.

In this case, though, the lid is somewhat off due to their actions during the prison break.

I would suggest simply accelerating the timescale on their particular issues. Have the moon become full sometime soon, during the journey through the Underdark, and play out their transformation as something of a social skill challenge.

If the party is willing and able to persuade them both, they resist the curse and refuse to change, and stay with the group, but say they can't take the lead in combat because they're afraid that if they're hurt they might still lose control and accidentally hurt a friend.

If even one of them is not successfully persuaded, that one will go full wererat and flee the group, and their twin will follow.

If the party react poorly to the revelation of the twins' nature, or roll really badly at persuading them, they go full wererat and leap to attack.

Incidentally, I did eventually have the twins hit with a full moon - I had it happen during the sacrifice ceremony at Sloobudoop, positing that the Kuo Toa had timed it to coincide with a spring tide - and one question that came up at that point for me was how long it takes for the curse of lycanthropy to take hold on a new victim. The Monster Manual doesn't suggest any delayed onset, but in fiction the transformation tends to be more gradual. As a result, when they attacked one of the Kuo Toa and bit him, he immediately sprouted fur and a rat-tail as it was still a full moon, which felt a little bit off.

I think with our group, their change was triggered on the way to Sloobudoop. We found a domesticated carrion crawler and made make-shift saddles for the group to ride it (eww) out of rope. The twins turned into giant rats while we were on it, slipped out of the ropes, and disappeared into the underdark.

 

[MarkB]

I think with our group, their change was triggered on the way to Sloobudoop. We found a domesticated carrion crawler and made make-shift saddles for the group to ride it (eww) out of rope. The twins turned into giant rats while we were on it, slipped out of the ropes, and disappeared into the underdark.

I'm running the campaign at our local gaming club, in 10-12 week segments, which means that I can't guarantee getting the same group of players the next time I run it. I wrote the twins out after Sloobudoop, not because they were OP, but because only a couple of the original group were continuing, and it felt unbalanced to leave them with 'their' NPCs while the new players had no companions.

Shortly after that they picked up Glabbagool, who's proven to be a keeper, with the players surprising me with their determination and ingenuity at keeping him around even after I threw some fairly formidable barriers in their way.

 

[CapnZapp]

The twins are erratic and whimsical. That alone should make them useless in combat.

Yes, they're pretty much at Wolverine levels of indestructible, but they might react by fleeing when attacked.

In other situations you might have them simply wander off, leave their guard post and generally be immature and unreliable.

Don't play them as disciplined soldiers and you should be fine - all the spotlight should easily fall back on the player characters.

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