D&D 5E (2024) Pact Of Chain Warlock is really powerful now.

[Zardnaar]

To me, the biggest problem with the bladelock is fragility. The hexblade was almost "mandatory" not just because of the cha to hit feature (which is now available to all bladelocks, a good thing) but also for armor. It seems they aren't giving the new hexblade more armor (a good thing?), but that essentially means that a bladelock benefits immensely from a 1 level fighter dip. Fighting style, a bit of self healing, weapons masteries, con save proficiency, armor...

And honestly, it sorts of bothers me that the concept doesn't quite work without multiclassing.

edit: getting off-topic here. Back on pack of the Chain. Yes, Zardnaar is correct that there isn't enough invocations to be great with both blade and chain. However, taking just the basic chain pact and nothing else is already quite beneficial. The scouting potential alone...

Chaon pact build ove been eyeing up for a whole is quasit+ summon undead.

Once the familiar becomes eh focus more on control.

I allowed a 2014 race for medium armor.

You also kinda need 13 strength as lack of shield proficiency means two handed weapon is kinda almost mandatory.

Heavily incentive to MC probably as Paladin or fighter as you'll want 14 dex anyway.

 

[Tessarael]

Sorry, wrong thread. Deleted.

 

[mellored]

befuddlement if you expect to see at least one caster each day which is a pretty good chance at high level

Maybe, maybe not.
In my limited experience, i probably average 2 of the 3 spells per day. Meaning I have a dead level most of the time.
Foresight was always useful.

Didn't play a 2024 warlock yet, but Tasha's Bubbling Cauldron should also be useful every day. So that mitigate some of it.

9th: obviously foresight, gate, or true polymorph, sad that Warlocks don't get wish but oh well

Are these things insanely powerful? Not really, no. But they aren't pointless nothing like you portray them to be.

It's not a 2014 elemental monk, no. Didn't mean to imply that. It's still a functioning class.

But your not getting the same thing other casters are.

Also where is the +4 AC coming from...?

+3 dex +12 studded leather (15)
To
+2 dex + 15 Half Plate + 2 shield (19)

Could add defensive style for another +1.

 

[ECMO3]

To me, the biggest problem with the bladelock is fragility.

With short rest recharge and Armor of Agathys I don't see them as particularly fragile. It is not as tanky as some fighters, Paladins and Bladesingers but it is more than adequate.

Also I think most hard melee bladelocks are going to be running armor of shadows.

 

[Zardnaar]

With short rest recharge and Armor of Agathys I don't see them as particularly fragile. It is not as tanky as some fighters, Paladins and Bladesingers but it is more than adequate.

Also I think most hard melee bladelocks are going to be running armor of shadows.

Armor of Agathys is kinda meh imho unless you're running stoneskin or are fiendpact.

That's the other issue of bladelocks. Cast Agathys vs control vs Spirit Shroudvs Eldritch smite or whatever. Hell aid if you are celestial.

Hence my play a Paladin comment it's just easier than bladelock imho.

Im running something close to the 5.5 dmg magic items. Think the Warlock has racial armor, legendary greatsword and a pact keeper wan/rod and nice armor to.

She's level 10.

 

[ECMO3]

That's the other issue of bladelocks. Cast Agathys vs control vs Spirit Shroudvs Eldritch smite or whatever. Hell aid if you are celestial.

With pact slots you can do both, especially aid, which you can do in the morning at wake up and then tac on a quick short rest.

If you are going hard into melee pact of blade with a single-class Warlock, I think you are either going to get medium armor through a feat or you are going to be dex first and go with a Shadowblade and Scimitar and weapon mastery or the dual wielder feat with weapon mastery.

It is easier to do melee with a Paladin, Fighter, Monk or Barbarian but you are not getting high level spells with those classes and won't be as flexibile.

 

[Zardnaar]

With pact slots you can do both, especially aid, which you can do in the morning at wake up and then tac on a quick short rest.

If you are going hard into melee pact of blade with a single-class Warlock, I think you are either going to get medium armor through a feat or you are going to be dex first and go with a Shadowblade and Scimitar, armor of shadows and the dual wielder feat.

It is easier to do melee with a Paladin, Fighter, Monk or Barbarian but you are not getting high level spells with those classes and won't be as flexibile.

I thinking dex based dual wielding Paladins splash.

 

[Ancalagon]

With short rest recharge and Armor of Agathys I don't see them as particularly fragile. It is not as tanky as some fighters, Paladins and Bladesingers but it is more than adequate.

Also I think most hard melee bladelocks are going to be running armor of shadows.

So if you have armor of shadows and max dex, your AC is 18... but now you aren't maxing out your cha. And your dex won't be max for a while anyway. You can maybe afford to cast one defensive spell (AA is ok, but unless you have an easy way to re-fill it, it's not that great). If you have medium AC and shield proficiency you can get a decent AC without needing a very high dex score and you can trade armor of shadows for a more useful invocation.

Otherwise... what other melee-focused character has less defensive capacity? A rogue perhaps? the 2024 monk's parry ability has made them far more resilient.

I've been thinking about it - it does "bother" me that the single class bladelock is a bit vulnerable, but upon further thought, it's kind of required for balance issues. If a bladelock was a tough as, say, an EK, why bother playing an EK then?

A lot of these problems are solved by taking a single level of fighter, and the resulting PC is perhaps a bit too strong (a lot more competitive with an EK for example). However, for a full spell caster even a single level dip is a significant sacrifice - it means that HALF of the campaign you will be one spell level behind (level 6/1 you have level 3 spells while the level 7 caster has level 4, for example).

edit: MC and roleplay has often been a challenge, but in this case I do like the "story" being told - low level fighter finds a peculiar magic sword...

 

[mellored]

Armor of Agathys is kinda meh imho unless you're running stoneskin or are fiendpact.

Or barbarian.
Medium armor.
Rage doesn't end AoA (or Mirror Image).
+2 damage and advantage on 3 attacks.
And a lot of the invocations aren't spells.

 

[TaranTheWanderer]

So, I'm now running a game with a Pact of Chain Warlock and he has one of those sphinxes. Holy, it's destroying everything. 1d4+2d6 radiant damage every round. It does more than the greatsword wielding barbarian. It has 24hp

They are 3rd level now and the character never goes into combat. Also, we are fighting lots of undead so the radiant damage is nerfing the zombie ability....but with how True Strike works now, radiant damage is pretty common place.