D&D 4E Paizo and 4e.

[Beckett]

I don't envy your position, Erik.

Your post on the Paizo boards sounded very frustrated and even a little bitter, but then, if my livelihood and that of over two dozen other people depended on getting the 4E rules, I'd imagine I'd have similar feelings that might come through in my writings.

Although I'm not sure if I'll continue subscribing into the third Pathfinder series, I hope Paizo switches over so I'll be able to readily use the great stuff you guys put out. Which means I hope (as you do) that WotC gets the rules out ASAP.

 

[meomwt]

Paizo will support 4e provided that we think the system is cool, that the OGL allows us to do so in a way that makes sense for our business, and if we think the switch would be in the best interest of our readers.

Business head.

I am personally excited by a lot of what I've seen and heard about fourth edition, and I hope to get to use the cool new rules at my table and in products that support the game we all love.

Geek-head

But I've got to see the rules and the SRD before I can say one way or another. That's just common sense.

Paizo is a serious business. We have 26 employees and support a network of freelance writers and artists. We have the largest mail order hobby shop on the internet, and we are in for the Long Haul. It's an important decision, and it's one that's still in the making.

My emphasis. Paizo need to be able to make $$ now that WotC have pulled their big sellers from under them. They are publishing new modules and AP books for the current edition of the game (today) which, by all accounts, is high quality and finding a good audience.

We absolutely are not staking out ground as the "anti-4e." I have the utmost respect for our friends at Wizards of the Coast and wish them the best of luck with the new edition. Their success with the new game breeds success for the whole industry.

And Erik's lengthy and thoughtful piece on the Paizo boards wasn't in any way "anti-4e." What it was, in essence, was an essay laying out where Paizo are in terms of the 4e material they need right freakin' now in order to write and produce a Pathfinder or GameMastery adventure in time for GenCon in 2008. And right now, they don't got it.

I sympathise with Erik and Paizo. I really do. It seems that they'll still be producing a 3.5e AP for up to a year after the cool new 4e toy comes out (kinda like a video game developer still selling PS2 discs now PS3 is the cool toy). Is that likely to affect their sales and business plan? Heck, yes! Becasue although there will be lots of 3.xE grognards out there, a lot more will want to convert to the new system and play new adventures straight away.

I don't believe that it is WotC trying to pull the rug out from under thrid-party developers. I do believe that they've not even considered when third-party developers need the new SRD or OGL. The change to 4e is being handled in a haphazard manner (starting with the denial it was in production) and is ill-thought-out on a number of fronts (DI, for example).

Just my two penn'orth.

 

[Largomad]

Mmm no, Erik's post on paizo's board don't strikes me as an anti 4e rant.

 

[Erik Mona]

I know for a fact that the folks at WotC have considered the issue. I ascribe absolutely no malice to them about this. We are lucky to have a chance to see the rules at all. It's beyond cool that Wizards of the Coast is continuing the d20 tradition. I remember the heady times at Wizards during the launch of third edition, and I'll bet it would shock most readers here the number of balls our friends at Wizards are juggling right now. To hazard a guess, I'll bet that any time Scott Rouse isn't in a meeting these days there are two or three people standing at his desk in his office asking for a minute of his time or getting him to sign off on "one little thing" or whatever. The pace of work leading up to an edition launch is unbelievable. Saying that the OGL is not their highest priority right now in no way means it isn't a high priority, if you catch my drift.

Wizards tells us this material is coming, and I believe them.

--Erik

 

[meomwt]

...I'll bet that any time Scott Rouse isn't in a meeting these days there are two or three people standing at his desk in his office asking for a minute of his time or getting him to sign off on "one little thing" or whatever. The pace of work leading up to an edition launch is unbelievable. Saying that the OGL is not their highest priority right now in no way means it isn't a high priority, if you catch my drift.

I hope my previous post didn't sound malicious against WotC. It isn't. I realise that they are hard at it, pulling together a vast new gaming engine takes a lot of effort. What I meant to say (and perhaps only implied) is that the pace they are working at only allows them to consider their internal needs and deadlines, and that they don't have the resources (time, personnel, whatever) to devote to supporting the third-party publishers which have been a major success story of 3.xE (and I hope they will want to make into a success story for 4E).

 

[Vigilance]

It is my impression that Paizo is setting itself up as the anti-4e company, aided by the fans on its forums.

Does anyone else get this impression?

Cheers!

I definitely don't get that impression.

The quote on his boards is one of those things that could be read either way, but if you listen to the awesome interview that Chris Pramas did with Erik Mona on the GR podcast, Erik's position is pretty clearly "I can't make a decision until I've seen the game and seen the license, but I hope 4e is something I can support".

Waiting until he's seen the rules and seen the license seems like common sense to me.

 

[wedgeski]

Paizo are keeping their options open. It's the vocal 3ed fanbase that are trying to raise them up on an anti-4ed platform. I don't envy those guys at the moment.

 

[JoeGKushner]

Fair enough.



Actually, I think Paizo has dug their own hole here: Pathfinder.

By committing to Pathfinder, they've killed their ability to adapt quickly. They have six month spans where they must use one edition. (And, let's face it, Paizo probably knew before anyone else that 4e was coming, due to the cancellation of the magazines). Orcus and Necromancer aren't in that bind.

Cheers!

But how much of a hole is it? Can they put Pathfinder on hold?

Can they do a shorter adventure arc?

Can they do Pathfinder: MOnsters or something for a few months?

It's only as much of a hole as they make it.

 

[Wisdom Penalty]

This is pretty simple. If Paizo does NOT switch to 4E, Paizo will wither and - likely - die.

Doesn't matter if 4E is superb or stinks. Doesn't matter if the SRD comes out early or late. Nothing matters.

You're kidding yourself, gentle readers, if you think otherwise.

And, by the gods, I hope Paizo (and other companies) don't base their business decisions on the poetic declarations of their messageboard folks. Show me ten posters who claim they will fanatically support a "3.75" edition, and I'll show you one who's maybe telling the truth.

Paizo ain't that Big, and ain't that Good, and it sure as Sunday ain't Wizards of the Coast.

Just the facts, ma'am. Just the facts.

W.P.

 

[DaveMage]

It is my impression that Paizo is setting itself up as the anti-4e company, aided by the fans on its forums.

If Paizo wanted to be the anti-4E company they would have already declared that they are staying with 3.5.