Pathfinder vs. 3.5?
- Thread starter Ry
- Start date
Simple version: Pathfinder looks like it's there to add tons of options to players. It streamlines a thing or two (CMB), but mostly it just adds options (and, to many, that also means power level).
Both are very system-heavy...but I assume you already know what you're looking for.
Both are very system-heavy...but I assume you already know what you're looking for.
kitsune9
Adventurer
I can't tell you what is "improved" or what they did "poorly", because that would be a matter of individual taste. However, I can show some differences. I don't have this stuff memorized, so you Pathfinder fanboys don't jump down my throat if I make a mistake or I don't cover your favorite change. Feel free to add to what I'm saying here.
Races--slightly tweaked where pretty much all the races have a net +2 modifier to the ability scores. With the exception to humans and half-elves, the other races, get +2 to two abilities and -2 to one ability whereas humans and h/e get +2 to any ability of their choice. Other stuff too in the races, but nothing earthshaking.
Classes--some got tweaked, others got major revisions, but essentially it would seem that the classes have more abilities and powers. HD are more consistent to BAB. If you have a good BAB, you get a d10, okay BAB d8, poor BAB d6. Barbarians are the exception with d12.
My personal favorites is the treatment of cleric to channel positive/negative energy and sorcerers with their bloodlines in which they get certain abilities depending upon which bloodline they have for their character.
Feats--changes to some feats like power attack and cleave. For cleave, instead of getting an extra attack on an adjacent foe after you drop a baddie, you get an extra attack on a different foe should the first attack hit.
Skills--fewer. Example: Tumble, Balance, and Jump is now Acrobatics. Hide and Move Silently is now Stealth. The ranking system is different.
Rules--some examples is they removed XP costs in casting spells, they have a Combat Manuever Bonus for resolving Grapple and such, and turning undead is different in which the cleric can channel positive energy as a burst that deals damage and requires a Will save on the undead to flee from combat.
Again, I can't really say this is an improvement or a step in the wrong direction as everyone has different tastes. All my players downloaded the Beta which is free from Paizo, so you check it out.
My gaming group is enjoying Pathfinder ourselves and we haven't run into a major issues. It feels and pretty much plays like 3.x for us.
Keep in mind that Pathfinder is still in its Beta version and will certainly have some additional changes before its published in Aug 09.
-That being said Pathfinder has made a number of changes to the core classes that provide more options and increases the overall strength (power) so that they are more in line with classes and PrC's that were published in later 3.5 books (Complete series).
-They've made a number of minor changes to hit points, races etc that on their own are minor.
-A number of spells have been modified so you have fewer instances of "save or die".
-The biggest change for me was the consolidation of the various combat moves (Trip, Sunder etc) under a single mechanic.
I'm a big fan of 3.5 and many of the variants that came out (AE, IH etc). I find the changes to be more along the line of a set of really solid house rules like Unearthed Arcana, rather than anything fundamentally different from the 3.5 core rules. "Backwards Compatibility" is a goal of the design team, and even though we see many different opinions as to just how "compatible" Pathfinder is to 3.5, in my Ptolus games I didn't see any real problems mixing Pathfinder and Complete classes. The only exception to that are the "save or die spells that were published in later 3.5 books. They obviously haven't been converted yet so I had to do it myself.
I hope that helps.
-That being said Pathfinder has made a number of changes to the core classes that provide more options and increases the overall strength (power) so that they are more in line with classes and PrC's that were published in later 3.5 books (Complete series).
-They've made a number of minor changes to hit points, races etc that on their own are minor.
-A number of spells have been modified so you have fewer instances of "save or die".
-The biggest change for me was the consolidation of the various combat moves (Trip, Sunder etc) under a single mechanic.
I'm a big fan of 3.5 and many of the variants that came out (AE, IH etc). I find the changes to be more along the line of a set of really solid house rules like Unearthed Arcana, rather than anything fundamentally different from the 3.5 core rules. "Backwards Compatibility" is a goal of the design team, and even though we see many different opinions as to just how "compatible" Pathfinder is to 3.5, in my Ptolus games I didn't see any real problems mixing Pathfinder and Complete classes. The only exception to that are the "save or die spells that were published in later 3.5 books. They obviously haven't been converted yet so I had to do it myself.
I hope that helps.
I like that they streamlined skills. Are Spot, Search and Listen also condensed into one as well?
BluWolf
Explorer
Given this criteria I would say stay with 3.5 over Pathfinder. I like what Pathfinder is doing and have incorporated many of these things into my E10 game. However I think the Power-race" has scaled much like 4e, it seems to be escalating.
For Example (and this could have an impact in E6), fighters gain a feat every level. In a 6 lvl game this does not grant a HUGE number of additional feats but it does raise the ainty STS.
Woas
First Post
Yes, and it is now called Perception, and includes all 5 senses as possible sources of alertness.
It's not as major a decision as people are making it out to be. If 3.5 has all the rules you need, there is more than enough gaming content out there to keep you running for YEARS. The Pathfinder Rules are just going to be tweaked 3.5 rules (backwards compatibility is a priority) but they have the advantage of active developement and management. If it does it for you, STAY with 3.5... ESPECIALLY if you generate your own loacations and NPCs. If 2nd or 1st do it for you, stay there. If 4e is more your thing, go there. It's gaming! Have fun! 
Pathfinder does have a few rather weird changes, such as the apparent nerfing of trip and power attack (is the math that hard? PA is an option, not an obligation!). The attack maneuvers seem solely the purview of npcs, considering the fairly low success rate PCs will be expecting.
Spellcasters still seem as strong as ever. It seems almost as though the designers knew that something is wrong with the classes, but no idea of just where the problems lie.
Some of the new features are nice though, such as races getting a net stat bonus, faster feat progression, rebalancing of spells such as polymorph/wild-shape, and consolidated skill lists.
Seems like for every problem they solve, a new one crops up as a consequence. So may not necessarily be any better or worse, just different.
How backwards compatible is pathfinder anyways? It seems like converting your PCs is going to be a pain.
Spellcasters still seem as strong as ever. It seems almost as though the designers knew that something is wrong with the classes, but no idea of just where the problems lie.
Some of the new features are nice though, such as races getting a net stat bonus, faster feat progression, rebalancing of spells such as polymorph/wild-shape, and consolidated skill lists.
Seems like for every problem they solve, a new one crops up as a consequence. So may not necessarily be any better or worse, just different.
How backwards compatible is pathfinder anyways? It seems like converting your PCs is going to be a pain.
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