Pc's carrying Pc's

[rvalle]

I'd personally allow it. Make it a move action to pick up the character. That what it's move action (pick up), move action (move), free action (drop/put down). So that character spends his entire turn just moving around the mage. Sure the mage is in a different place, but he's only moved what? 30ft? Mixed with the mage casting and moving, it's what? 50-60 ft moved total? If the other character wants to kill their turn for that round, I see no trouble with it. Sure, they get to jockey the mage around, but they're doing absolutely nothing. Throw some monsters with SR at them or some golems. Let them know that if they just move the mage around, they're screwed and that the mage isn't the central character. That they all have to work together. That seems to be the crux of the problem, that they see the mage as thier only (or biggest) weapon. All classes should contribute to combat.

If you really don't want them moving the mage, just have the mage make ride checks, or concentration checks for being moved. That'll mess up some of his spells and make him reconsider. (It's also more realistic).

(btw: Hi, new to these forums, used to Giant In The Playground.)

Welcome!

The problem wasn't moving the mage around in an offensive way... though I did use that as an example. It was more about picking them up and moving them when it was time to cut and run. If all they are going to do is cut and run that is fine and I don't have a problem with it. It was when they started to get gamey with it and try to carry the mage AND let the mage get his turn in.

It was a very strange 'battle' (with Madness from WLD for those that know the warped beastie). Besides the picking up and carrying there was a Silence cast so the party couldn't talk and cordinate. They were never sure if they were fighting or running and had an odd mix of both. Then add in Madness's Acid Spit for blindness and it was a Keystone cops night. The running skirmish lasted for over 30 rounds.

Well, it looks like there is nothing official (though I need to check out those mount rules. Thanks Magesmiley!). I'll stick with what I have so far. You can do it but the person being carried mostly loses his turn and you can't pick him up if he takes his turn that round as you would be picking him up WHILE he does his turn.

It does lead to some wonky questions of why this works like this but Bull Rush and other things don't but I think this will work out ok.

Thanks for the replies!

rv

 

[Seffbasilisk]

Well it's your call, as this is all for you, but I do think that making the person being picked up spend part of his turn, or not being able to pick him up just because he moved, doesn't make a lot of sense. You could rule that if he cast a spell this turn and you're picking him up that theres a % chance he gets zapped with 1d6 of pure magic energy or something.

If they couldn't co-ordinate, then the picking up and such would make more sense, if they were using it as a standard battle tactic i'd be worried. If the mage is blind AND they're silenced you might have to talk about metagaming, otherwise I could see him striking out at whatever grabs him.

 

[Infiniti2000]

Make it a move action to pick up the character. That what it's move action (pick up), move action (move), free action (drop/put down).

That's only reasonable if you say that picking up a creature is the same thing as picking up an item (manipulating). While possible, it's weird in that you allow different rules when the creature is an opponent. In other words, either a creature is an item or not, you can't really arbitrarily decide to use different rules for different times (unless explicitly mentioned).

I would not allow it because it creates an inconsistency. I would consider allowing it, but only if the target were "willing", i.e. spends a readied standard action first (thus he gets no more than an additional move action), and he is denied his Dex bonus to AC while carried.

 

[Seffbasilisk]

I'd go for the denied the dex to AC while carried, but 'willing' you don't need to ready a standard action for. Otherwise spells with 'willing' targets would be a lot harder to cast. (you and your discrepancies)

And as for 'unwilling' targets, it's less then a standard action to grapple (if you have BAB +6 or higher) so I don't see the issue.

 

[Infiniti2000]

I'd go for the denied the dex to AC while carried, but 'willing' you don't need to ready a standard action for.

Well, it's not so much what action is required as that I think some action should be required. Call it "concentration" to avoid affecting your carrier's balance. I'd consider reducing it to a move action, but certainly not less.

The big issue is avoiding the fire bucket scenario.

And as for 'unwilling' targets, it's less then a standard action to grapple (if you have BAB +6 or higher) so I don't see the issue.

You cannot pick up an opponent (automatically) and move him in the same round. They are not comparable situations at all.

 

[pallandrome]

hmm, with enough coordination and personell, we could have a cross city halfing transit system in the works here!

 

[rvalle]

Yep! Anywhere you want to go in the city in 6 seconds or less!

AND you can, somehow, cast a spell during those same 6 seconds too!



rv

 

[Infiniti2000]

Yep! Anywhere you want to go in the city in 6 seconds or less!

AND you can, somehow, cast a spell during those same 6 seconds too!

Depending on your initiative, though, you could be casting it miles away from your original target.

 

[Thurbane]

This question comes up surprisingly often...I seem to remember some rule about a "mount" having to be one (or more) sizes larger than the "rider"?

 

[Space Coyote]

I dont see an issue with the general concept of what is happening: a mage takes his turn to cast a spell and another character picks them up to carry them, so the mage can still cast and move. No difference from riding a mount and letting the mount do the movement for you. So I would treat it the same way.

To avoid arguments, this would have to be poiinted out to players before you first implement it. If you are moved by another character and then cast a spell, you make a Concentration check, like riding a mount (cannot recall the DC). If the casting character goes before the Mover (and therefore did not make a Concentration check), then rule that the mover can pickup the caster, but not move with them, this turn, with the logic being that since a Concentration check was not made during the spell casting, the caster was not being moved at the Mover must have "waited" till the casting was over.

I can see how silly this "move" and "move and object" situation can get: Imagine if your players organized 10000 people across a plains, each 30' apart. The first person moves 30' to the second person and drops an object as a free action. Second person picks up the object as a move action, then moves 30' to the third person and repeats the process. Technically, you can have the 10000 people move the object 300,000' in 6 seconds hehe