D&D (2024) Playtest 8 Monk Discussion

[Mistwell]

Let's not forget monks can easily do decent damage while dodging, making them theoretically even tankier.

With no armor, lower hit points, and ongoing multiple attribute problems causing Con to be lower, I don't see them ever being a tank even with dodge. But at least now they can maybe hold their own in melee combat.

 

[mellored]

With no armor, lower hit points, and ongoing multiple attribute problems causing Con to be lower, I don't see them ever being a tank even with dodge. But at least now they can maybe hold their own in melee combat.

Oddly.

At level 2-4. You'll want to use your bonus action to flurry, and your regular action to dodge.

Level 5-9 it's the same.

Level 10+. Back to regular action dodge, with a bonus flurry.

 

[Stalker0]

With no armor, lower hit points, and ongoing multiple attribute problems causing Con to be lower, I don't see them ever being a tank even with dodge.

Standard 16 AC monk goes to ~21 AC with dodge. That's better AC than anyone else at those low levels.

 

[Mistwell]

Standard 16 AC monk goes to ~21 AC with dodge. That's better AC than anyone else at those low levels.

Depends on the levels but 21 AC is pretty standard in our games for the fighter and cleric and paladin. A single magic shield at low-mid levels is usually enough and those are not rare. But really the issue is the hit points.

I am not saying they can't be front line - they can. I just don't see them being a tank unless there is a subclass that will do more.

 

[Asisreo]

With no armor, lower hit points, and ongoing multiple attribute problems causing Con to be lower, I don't see them ever being a tank even with dodge. But at least now they can maybe hold their own in melee combat.

At 21 AC (effectively), they then can deflect whatever attacks do go through and with Uncanny Metabolism, its essentially having a d10 HD since you're getting an extra 1HP per monk level plus a little extra.

If you're a hand monk, you can restore even more HP at level 6.

And your AC still scales past level 1, unlike fighters or paladins who have to heavily invest in equipment and a fighting style to get to actual 21 AC but stay that way from levels 1-20. Assuming they get plate at level 1 at all.

 

[mellored]

Depends on the levels but 21 AC is pretty standard in our games for the fighter and cleric and paladin. A single magic shield at low-mid levels is usually enough and those are not rare. But really the issue is the hit points.

A single deflect attacks will make up the HP difference.

3 to match fighters second winds.

5 to match a paladin with lay on hands... not including spell slots.



Spending if your action to Dodge, and bonus action to punch, and don't take too much at once, over the course of a day... you can be the best tank.

 

[shadowoflameth]

I can't say I'm unhappy to see the monk lose Weapon Mastery as it was already tangled - and what it gets is mostly good. And using Dex for trip and push is just a nice QOL improvement.

The big thing is the improved bonus actions. Now a level 2 monk can unarmed attack, dash, or disengage as a bonus action without spending a Discipline (formerly Qi) point or even needing to make a main action attack. Huge improvement. And if you spend a discipline point you either get a second extra attack, to disengage-and-dodge, or to dash-and-disengage. And a 1/day recharge of discipline points on initiative is nice.

Deflect Attacks now works on melee attacks - which is huge.

Stunning Strike does damage when the creature saves as a consolation prize - again nice.

I think the level 1-6 (assuming a good subclass) monk is now good. And the new bonus action rules even give an answer to what a monk can do that a scimitar and shortsword fighter can't; they can use the Defense action and make an attack (with their bonus action) on the same turn, giving them more survivability when they chose.

Level 10 now has a needed buff - when you spend a ki point for Flurry of Blows you get two extra unarmed attacks not just one. (Plus the free one). This is good. I'm slightly concerned about levels 7-9 being soggy and situational in the wake of monk damage being pegged back by getting less use from Extra Attack than people with bigger weapons (Monks being MAD having less chance to use the new good feats) - but this is a huge improvement over the way it was in 2014 when levels 7-13 were all soggy and monk subclasses included the old Four Elements.

Warrior of the Hand looks good.

Secondary to the good stuff here, WotC stop it with the needless name changes of things. I've played with hundreds people over the decades and not heard from anyone offended by the word Ki.

 

[James Gasik]

Those are gone.

Replaced by "can't take opportunity attacks".

All of them?

 

[mellored]

All of them?

I can't say 100% universally.

But lots of monsters now have extra reactions. So they have been removing the "can't take reactions".
They even said so in a video.

Similarly, they are removing all the "resistance to non-magical weapons". Monks and moon druids now can deal force/radiant instead.

 

[Asisreo]

Does this mean that UA 8 monks with UA 6 Elements subclass can have free 50ft flight the entire time? Like passively just flying the entire time, only needing a bonus action to stay airborne for 10 minutes at a time?

Because my DM will be seeing Zaheer-like energy from my next monk if so.

I hope they update their 17th level feature to at least give the monk immunity to the damage type rather than resistance since the literal next level is when they'll get resistance to all damage types except force.