Please help me with some M&M Rules.

[Lord Pendragon]

Hey guys,

I am just starting to play in an M&M game, and creating my character. I have a few questions about the rules that I'm hoping folks can help me out with.

1. If I am understanding it correctly, there is NOT a limit on the number of ranks you can buy in your powers, regardless of Power Level. So in our PL6 game, I could still buy 10 ranks in Blast. However, there IS a limit on the DC modifier any power can have, so even though I can buy 10 ranks in Blast, it will still cap out its damage at +6 damage (for a DC of 16).

2. By buying the Alternate Power feat, you can effectively switch out one power for another, but cannot use them both at once. It's like a "setting" for a particular power. So I could buy 6 ranks in Force Field (6 pps), and then buy the feat Alternate Power (blast) (1pp). This would allow me to switch between a forcefield at rank 6 or a blast at rank 3 (which also would cost 6 pps, the total pp's spent on the base power, Force Field), but I could not use both powers in the same round.

However, if I spent an additional 2 pp's, I could make the two powers dynamic alternate powers. In this case, I CAN use them both at the same time, but I have to split the total pp's spent on the base power (6) between the two powers. So one round I could have a forcefield (rank 2) active and fire a blast (rank 2), while another round I could have a forcefield (rank 4) active and fire a blast (rank 1).

So basically, an array of powers has a power point value, and a number of "settings." Without further augmentation you can only have one "setting" active in any given round (and can change the setting as a free action once per round). If you pay an additional power point per alternate power feat, you can make that "setting" dynamic. This gives you the option of having 2 or more dynamic settings active simultaneously, but you are still limited to the total number of power points in the array.

I read and re-read the description of dynamic alternate powers, and this is the only thing that makes sense to me, even though the passage does not specifically say "dynamic powers CAN be used at the same time, unlike normal alternate powers." But I could definitely be misunderstanding something.

3. Regarding the toughness save. It's my understanding that your total toughness save is limited by the campaign Power Level. So in our game, your maximum Toughness bonus, after all powers, con, etc. is +6. Even if powers and abilities might make it higher, it's still capped at +6. This can only be changed if you trade off points from your defense cap, which also begins at +6. So you could lower your max defense to +3, in order to raise your toughness cap to +9.

My confusion comes from a spreadsheet I am using. After inputting my prospective build, the Toughness bonus reads as +7, which I imagine is the addition of a +1 bonus from Constitution and a +6 bonus from Force Field. But I haven't reduced my defense cap, so my understanding is that my Toughness should be capped at +6, regardless of my ranks in Force Field or Constitution. Am I wrong? Or can the Toughness cap be broken under certain circumstances?

4. I'm curious how equipment is handled in the game. Weapons such as shotguns have an equipment cost, but I couldn't find anything about how to keep players from going out and buying shotguns, etc. Or even easier, taking them from the thugs who are using them against them! What keeps the hero with mostly defensive powers from grabbing that assault rifle off the unconscious body of one of the archvillain's henchmen? Now he has all his defensive powers, plus a kick-ass assault rifle he didn't have to spend any points in equipment to acquire!

Thanks for any help.

 

[Jim Hague]

Hey guys,

I am just starting to play in an M&M game, and creating my character. I have a few questions about the rules that I'm hoping folks can help me out with.

1. If I am understanding it correctly, there is NOT a limit on the number of ranks you can buy in your powers, regardless of Power Level. So in our PL6 game, I could still buy 10 ranks in Blast. However, there IS a limit on the DC modifier any power can have, so even though I can buy 10 ranks in Blast, it will still cap out its damage at +6 damage (for a DC of 16).

Incorrect - the powers which provoke saves are affected by PL caps. Steve Kenson's said that buying 'excess' ranks to foil things like Nullify is a no-no. Powers like Flight and Telekinesis are not affected by caps. Also, see the section in the rulebook on Trade Offs for adjusting the PL caps.

2. By buying the Alternate Power feat, you can effectively switch out one power for another, but cannot use them both at once. It's like a "setting" for a particular power. So I could buy 6 ranks in Force Field (6 pps), and then buy the feat Alternate Power (blast) (1pp). This would allow me to switch between a forcefield at rank 6 or a blast at rank 3 (which also would cost 6 pps, the total pp's spent on the base power, Force Field), but I could not use both powers in the same round.

Correct!

However, if I spent an additional 2 pp's, I could make the two powers dynamic alternate powers. In this case, I CAN use them both at the same time, but I have to split the total pp's spent on the base power (6) between the two powers. So one round I could have a forcefield (rank 2) active and fire a blast (rank 2), while another round I could have a forcefield (rank 4) active and fire a blast (rank 1).

So basically, an array of powers has a power point value, and a number of "settings." Without further augmentation you can only have one "setting" active in any given round (and can change the setting as a free action once per round). If you pay an additional power point per alternate power feat, you can make that "setting" dynamic. This gives you the option of having 2 or more dynamic settings active simultaneously, but you are still limited to the total number of power points in the array.

I read and re-read the description of dynamic alternate powers, and this is the only thing that makes sense to me, even though the passage does not specifically say "dynamic powers CAN be used at the same time, unlike normal alternate powers." But I could definitely be misunderstanding something.

Incorrect. Alternate Power as a Feat is 1 pp, Dynamic Alternate Power is 2 pp, plus you need to make the base power Dynamic as well. Beyond that distinction, though, you're right.

3. Regarding the toughness save. It's my understanding that your total toughness save is limited by the campaign Power Level. So in our game, your maximum Toughness bonus, after all powers, con, etc. is +6. Even if powers and abilities might make it higher, it's still capped at +6. This can only be changed if you trade off points from your defense cap, which also begins at +6. So you could lower your max defense to +3, in order to raise your toughness cap to +9.

My confusion comes from a spreadsheet I am using. After inputting my prospective build, the Toughness bonus reads as +7, which I imagine is the addition of a +1 bonus from Constitution and a +6 bonus from Force Field. But I haven't reduced my defense cap, so my understanding is that my Toughness should be capped at +6, regardless of my ranks in Force Field or Constitution. Am I wrong? Or can the Toughness cap be broken under certain circumstances?

No, you're right - the Toughness cap is still +6, barring Trade Offs. You'll need to lower the Force Field to +5.

4. I'm curious how equipment is handled in the game. Weapons such as shotguns have an equipment cost, but I couldn't find anything about how to keep players from going out and buying shotguns, etc. Or even easier, taking them from the thugs who are using them against them! What keeps the hero with mostly defensive powers from grabbing that assault rifle off the unconscious body of one of the archvillain's henchmen? Now he has all his defensive powers, plus a kick-ass assault rifle he didn't have to spend any points in equipment to acquire!

Thanks for any help.

That's a GM control issue, honestly. There really isn't anything stopping characters from doing so. However, there's a few important things about Equipment:

1) Weapons always do either Lethal or Bruising damage, unlike powers like Blast. You can't switch.

2) Equipment always fails its Toughness saves against powers.

3) Equipment acquired as 'loot' works for a scene, then it goes away, unless either a Hero Point is spent (like inventions) or the character spends the appropriate PPs or Equipment points to acquire the item permanently.

 

[Ben Robbins]

4. I'm curious how equipment is handled in the game. Weapons such as shotguns have an equipment cost, but I couldn't find anything about how to keep players from going out and buying shotguns, etc. Or even easier, taking them from the thugs who are using them against them! What keeps the hero with mostly defensive powers from grabbing that assault rifle off the unconscious body of one of the archvillain's henchmen? Now he has all his defensive powers, plus a kick-ass assault rifle he didn't have to spend any points in equipment to acquire!

Jim makes good points. If you want to permit characters to pick weapons up but not worry about balance, you can try this option:

M&M PL Balance: Picking up the bazooka

It's intended for agent-level characters, but should work at any level. It let's characters use anything they find without changing their PL.

 

[Ben Robbins]

Incorrect - the powers which provoke saves are affected by PL caps. Steve Kenson's said that buying 'excess' ranks to foil things like Nullify is a no-no.

Very true. The PL limits affect what you can buy when you make the character, not just what you use at any moment. Important distinction.

 

[Lord Pendragon]

Incorrect - the powers which provoke saves are affected by PL caps. Steve Kenson's said that buying 'excess' ranks to foil things like Nullify is a no-no. Powers like Flight and Telekinesis are not affected by caps. Also, see the section in the rulebook on Trade Offs for adjusting the PL caps.

The problem I'm having is with the sample characters on pages 18-19 of the M&M core book (2nd ed). The PL10 Energy Controller has an Energy Control of 12 ranks. An Alternate Power Energy Blast would break the PL10 cap. Likewise, the Gadgeteer has Dazzle (visual) 12 listed. This would break the PL10 cap as well. What am I getting wrong here?

Incorrect. Alternate Power as a Feat is 1 pp, Dynamic Alternate Power is 2 pp, plus you need to make the base power Dynamic as well. Beyond that distinction, though, you're right.

I'm not sure where you're saying I am wrong. You can take an Alternate Power and later pay a second pp (for a total of 2) and make it a dynamic power. The rules seem pretty clear that you don't have to make the base power Dynamic, actually. In fact, the example scenario hero doesn't make the base power Dynamic at first, but only chooses to do so later. Or am I missing something?

No, you're right - the Toughness cap is still +6, barring Trade Offs. You'll need to lower the Force Field to +5.

Do I have to lower it? Or can I leave it at the legal +6 and just lose the +1 bonus until the campaign cap increases to PL7?

That's a GM control issue, honestly. There really isn't anything stopping characters from doing so. However, there's a few important things about Equipment:

1) Weapons always do either Lethal or Bruising damage, unlike powers like Blast. You can't switch.

2) Equipment always fails its Toughness saves against powers.

3) Equipment acquired as 'loot' works for a scene, then it goes away, unless either a Hero Point is spent (like inventions) or the character spends the appropriate PPs or Equipment points to acquire the item permanently.

Interesting. I am not the GM in this game, but our GM already pointed out your first point. We're fighting zombies at the moment, so that's not an issue, but certainly may become one later. I hadn't considered your second point, but our GM may have that in mind as well. We haven't yet fought superpowered enemies.

Thanks for your continued help. I'm liking the game, but there are always nuances to any new system that take getting used to.

 

[Krolik]

The problem I'm having is with the sample characters on pages 18-19 of the M&M core book (2nd ed). The PL10 Energy Controller has an Energy Control of 12 ranks. An Alternate Power Energy Blast would break the PL10 cap. Likewise, the Gadgeteer has Dazzle (visual) 12 listed. This would break the PL10 cap as well. What am I getting wrong here?

What you are not taking into account is the Trade-off rule from pages 24-25.

I'm not sure where you're saying I am wrong. You can take an Alternate Power and later pay a second pp (for a total of 2) and make it a dynamic power. The rules seem pretty clear that you don't have to make the base power Dynamic, actually. In fact, the example scenario hero doesn't make the base power Dynamic at first, but only chooses to do so later. Or am I missing something?

You are not required to make the Base Power Dynamic. Whether or not you can make an Alternate Power Dynamic later is a GM's call.

Do I have to lower it? Or can I leave it at the legal +6 and just lose the +1 bonus until the campaign cap increases to PL7?

Technically you are required to lower it and then increase it later when the PL of the game increases. Unless you use Trade-offs.

 

[Ben Robbins]

The problem I'm having is with the sample characters on pages 18-19 of the M&M core book (2nd ed). The PL10 Energy Controller has an Energy Control of 12 ranks. An Alternate Power Energy Blast would break the PL10 cap. Likewise, the Gadgeteer has Dazzle (visual) 12 listed. This would break the PL10 cap as well. What am I getting wrong here?

The Energy Controller has an +8 attack, which is 2 below the cap, so she is allowed to have a 12 damage, which is 2 above the cap. You lower one to raise the other, but the total for any attack cannot exceed PL x 2 (so you can have attack 10/damage 10, attack 4/damage 16, etc).

Do I have to lower it? Or can I leave it at the legal +6 and just lose the +1 bonus until the campaign cap increases to PL7?

You cannot buy a combination of traits that exceeds PL limits. So yes, you have to lower the force field, or lower your Con, or lower your defense to +5.

 

[Lord Pendragon]

What you are not taking into account is the Trade-off rule from pages 24-25.

Ah. I see. I hadn't registered the Attack/Damage trade-off rule, only the Toughness/Defense one. Thanks for pointing that it. Now all the sample characters make sense.

Technically you are required to lower it and then increase it later when the PL of the game increases. Unless you use Trade-offs.

Cool, I'll ask my GM.

Thanks for your help. Appreciate it.

 

[Dalamar]

I'm not sure where you're saying I am wrong. You can take an Alternate Power and later pay a second pp (for a total of 2) and make it a dynamic power. The rules seem pretty clear that you don't have to make the base power Dynamic, actually. In fact, the example scenario hero doesn't make the base power Dynamic at first, but only chooses to do so later. Or am I missing something?

The wording under the Alternate Power power feat can be rather daunting.

You are correct in that the base power doesn't have to be made dynamic. In that case, however, you can't dynamically alter the points in that "setting", it's either on or off. So in the specific example you used at first, you don't gain anything by making the array's single Alternate Power into a Dynamic Alternate Power since there are no other Dynamic powers in the array.
Or in other words, your specific example is figured out correctly (6PP for Force Field, 1PP for Alternate Power, and then 2PP to make them both Dynamic), but when you state the more general rule, you don't mention that making the base power Dynamic is also 1PP.

 

[Lord Pendragon]

You are correct in that the base power doesn't have to be made dynamic. In that case, however, you can't dynamically alter the points in that "setting", it's either on or off. So in the specific example you used at first, you don't gain anything by making the array's single Alternate Power into a Dynamic Alternate Power since there are no other Dynamic powers in the array.
Or in other words, your specific example is figured out correctly (6PP for Force Field, 1PP for Alternate Power, and then 2PP to make them both Dynamic), but when you state the more general rule, you don't mention that making the base power Dynamic is also 1PP.

Ah. My mistake in relating my thoughts, then. I should have used an example with 2 alternate powers, to illustrate that you would need to make 2 of the powers in the array dynamic to gain any benefit, but one of them need not be the primary power in the array.